YupMorrigu wrote:Ya think - it's not like what you are writing is anything original or new - heard it all before!David wrote:Thinking "blah blah blah blah" or throwing back non-sequiturs kind of suggests the exact opposite to seriously considering what someone is writing.Morrigu wrote: How condescending! Maybe she did and then thought as I did - blah blah blah
It's your opinion nothing more, nothing less - and it doesn't matter how many times you say it, write it, sing it - it's still just your opinion and not some " absolute truth" that everyone must conform to.
Bit like my stance on animal rights - gives me the pip that other people don't see it - but many don't - and in the end it's just my opinion vs their opinion!
Yay or nay - should Britain vote to leave the EU?
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think positive
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You cant fix stupid, turns out you cant quarantine it either!
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pietillidie
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pietillidie
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^Nice avoidance effort there, Trumpkopf.
You wouldn't know your arse from your breakfast as to the costing here. For all you know, they might be right; you've done zero analysis of it and wouldn't know where to start.
And that's the point. These loon bags are inventing uncertainty and diverting attention away from the serious work which needs doing in the UK with zero knowledge of the implications.
I mean, WTF? The UK will solve zero of its pressing budgetary and urban problems in return for instability and potentially heavy costs at a moment of global economic weakness. Only a complete tool would take that blind risk with the lives of others.
It's another kick-and-hope play from the same unstable psychiatries who played kick-and-hope with Iraq and are trying to do it through Drumpf.
Negligent, irresponsible and irrational. As I say, tantrum-throwing children who are willing to wreck the joint to impose themselves on the planet - even if the only thing they achieve is to leave a stinking skidmark behind.
You wouldn't know your arse from your breakfast as to the costing here. For all you know, they might be right; you've done zero analysis of it and wouldn't know where to start.
And that's the point. These loon bags are inventing uncertainty and diverting attention away from the serious work which needs doing in the UK with zero knowledge of the implications.
I mean, WTF? The UK will solve zero of its pressing budgetary and urban problems in return for instability and potentially heavy costs at a moment of global economic weakness. Only a complete tool would take that blind risk with the lives of others.
It's another kick-and-hope play from the same unstable psychiatries who played kick-and-hope with Iraq and are trying to do it through Drumpf.
Negligent, irresponsible and irrational. As I say, tantrum-throwing children who are willing to wreck the joint to impose themselves on the planet - even if the only thing they achieve is to leave a stinking skidmark behind.
In the end the rain comes down, washes clean the streets of a blue sky town.
Help Nick's: http://www.magpies.net/nick/bb/fundraising.htm
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pietillidie
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^Too tired to look it up (9am here and still awake!)
Off the top of my head, the UK is a 3T dollar economy, so you're right, you'd have to compare it proportionately. But, it's a hard calculation to make because of the many unaccounted benefits which come from positive free trade flows.
Broadly, if you look at how much a country taxes, how much its citizens earn, and what the country's quality of life is, you get a picture of how much value government spending is giving you. Thus, Germany would likely be getting much better value than, say Southern European countries, or France. But, some higher-spending country like Finland might be doing better than some lower-spending country because its quality of life is much better.
The UK probably falls in the middle of the wealthiest country pack; not getting the return on spending Germany gets, and not having the same very HQ life of some EU countries, but doing significantly better than Southern Europe and of course less-developed newcomers.
The astonishing thing is that the UK is only middle of the best countries out there, yet Brexiters talk as if it is being pulled down by *higher quality countries than itself*. This is the hilarious delusion which never ceases to amuse me.
The UK is a very good country with a fantastically rich history, but in reality it has shitehole after shitehole suburb which pulls it down and devalues too much of its working population. We also know it is prone to irrational overseas misadventure, as its recent war disasters show. It needs the modulating sense of the EU; the Brexit dickwads would think the streets of Slough were paved with gold and flowing with milk and honey if it weren't for the vast superiority of many EU cities putting much of urban Britain to shame.
Off the top of my head, the UK is a 3T dollar economy, so you're right, you'd have to compare it proportionately. But, it's a hard calculation to make because of the many unaccounted benefits which come from positive free trade flows.
Broadly, if you look at how much a country taxes, how much its citizens earn, and what the country's quality of life is, you get a picture of how much value government spending is giving you. Thus, Germany would likely be getting much better value than, say Southern European countries, or France. But, some higher-spending country like Finland might be doing better than some lower-spending country because its quality of life is much better.
The UK probably falls in the middle of the wealthiest country pack; not getting the return on spending Germany gets, and not having the same very HQ life of some EU countries, but doing significantly better than Southern Europe and of course less-developed newcomers.
The astonishing thing is that the UK is only middle of the best countries out there, yet Brexiters talk as if it is being pulled down by *higher quality countries than itself*. This is the hilarious delusion which never ceases to amuse me.
The UK is a very good country with a fantastically rich history, but in reality it has shitehole after shitehole suburb which pulls it down and devalues too much of its working population. We also know it is prone to irrational overseas misadventure, as its recent war disasters show. It needs the modulating sense of the EU; the Brexit dickwads would think the streets of Slough were paved with gold and flowing with milk and honey if it weren't for the vast superiority of many EU cities putting much of urban Britain to shame.
In the end the rain comes down, washes clean the streets of a blue sky town.
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Wokko
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pietillidie
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10 seconds to show you have less than a Wikipedia knowledge of the problem, and yet here you peddling your empty hot airon the subject. Welcome back to the grossly negligent Afghanistan and Iraq debates, folks!
I mean, that article is embarrassing stuff: "The EU is shrinking as a proportion of world GDP"; well, thank you, Isaac Newton, for your world-shattering primary school demography lesson. (In its defense, it's not trying to be technical, just topical in order to generate web hits).
Cliches about sovereignty in a world of agreements preventing war and chaos; whingeing over the difficulty of having to negotiate with other humans on a planet zooming towards 10B people; sooking hysteria about having "zero say" as a childish way of saying "I want complete control"; and a petulant Basil Fawlty-like inability to acknowledge Germany's leadership and excellence in many areas.
One of the few serious points in there, the destructive EU banker austerity thrust upon Greece, is no different than UK policy! And it wouldn't become any different at all; the banks would lobby for the same in the UK, and the redneck British public would kick Greece with just as much bigotry as Germany did. Every single bit as much! The lack of self awareness is the stuff of Mr. Bean!
Brexiters only whinge 38 times daily at the Greek, Spanish and Eastern European incomers competing with them and helping make their job market vigorous. Like they wouldn't kick Greece!
And, just which UK banks and financial institutions do you trust more than those of the EU? UK banks also vigorously worked to crash the world economy and grab bailouts; they also pushed for austerity; and the pound did nothing to protect the UK from a huge collapse. As did those over the pond and round the corner behind the back shed.
In other words, banking is banking is banking; it's transnational capital wanting optimal returns for minimal risk everywhere. No one anywhere, but sane countries like Australia, with smaller and more conservative financial markets, can (only then, somewhat) control the bastards. And London is the biggest financial monster in Europe; heck, Brits should be begging for any help in reining the ba$tards in.
I mean, really. Next time someone I know needs, say, ophthalmology advice, shall I send them your way for an "opinion"? Because you surely couldn't know less about ophthalmology than you do the UK and EU socio-economies.
As I say, it's Iraq all over again. It's negligent, low-percentage, regional-scale gambling once more. No lessons learned; no pause for thought; no self analysis; no insight.
(But that's a forte of the outcast, left or right, isn't it? Hoping a wild bet against the obvious or likely comes through, and hoping that victory will in turn will make the feeling of ostracism go away? But, at absolutely any cost?).
"No point dwelling in the past, old chap!"
"Indeed! Time to put our monumentally-failed roll-of-the-dice in Afghanistan and Iraq behind us."
"Hear, hear."
"Once we are done gambling with the stability of the EU, in a time of great chaos from North Africa to Russia, in the context of a vulnerable global economy, I think we should make it our goal to install one of my old afternoon tea favourites to the most powerful position in the world."
"Ah, yes, good fellow. The gingered rich fruitcake. Its time has surely come."
http://www.bbcgoodfood.com/recipes/2709 ... fruit-cake
In the end the rain comes down, washes clean the streets of a blue sky town.
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think positive
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pietillidie
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pietillidie
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^I get tired of the dead people and suffering and impoverishment caused by negligent and irresponsible big mouths showing less concern for the lives of others than their choice of toilet paper.
One day, you'll discover that serious decisions concerning other people's lives and well-being simply need to be separated from the voices of ill-treatment in our heads, as real as the injury to our emotional system is.
I bet you didn't even realise you have just repeated one of the great Iraq War arguments, almost verbatim: "Oh, but yours is just an opinion". Indeed, but I'm not the one proposing radical change. The onus is on the interveners to justify themselves, just as it was with Iraq.
Sure, a BRainlessExit could end marvellously well for all. It could. The Iraq invasion could've ended up all well and good, too. It could have.
But could is insufficient reason to undertake massive, high-risk changes at sensitive moments in history.
The US is weakening, and has little more to add than to negotiate with China. From Russia to Ukraine to Turkey to North Africa, Europe is surrounded by very unstable forces. This instability is going to worsen as the likes of Russia, Saudi Arabia and Iran thrash like cut snakes as the use of oil declines, and with it their economies.
Meanwhile, zero of Britain's challenges related to Europe. Zero. Britain is struggling to generate sufficient revenue to hold up its already mid-pack quality of life; links with European industry only support its efforts to rely less on the financial sector. NATO is an EU security blanket that benefits the UK, especially with the US focusing on the Pacific.
Disconnected money flows which have no regard for cities or countries as homes for human beings, such as those which power the London Financial District, have nothing more to add to Britain. Nothing. Zip. Zero. They're already too big a part of the economy, as the GFC demonstrated. Britain needs GDP that looks a lot more German, and a lot less Wall Street.
And yet, there are the BRainlessExiters building barriers with manufacturers across Europe. There they are hand-wringing as the millions of refugees its dumb ignore-Europe-and-partner-with-the-USA wars caused suffer and die, or join terrorist militias. There they are, making things more murky and complicated even as their own government slashes social budgets in a country whose quality of life is already behind the leading EU countries.
I was studying Austria today just for the heck of it, as I was playing a guessing game as to its main economic drivers. So, I usually ask the Beloved, or she asks me, to guess the composition of their economic output. I got forestry and paper, and manufactures going over the border to Germany, such as auto parts, right, as well as the easy one, skiing (tourism).
Then, I got to my 'ole favourite, expecting Austria to have about 10% higher GDP and employment associated with its manufacturing sector, as with Germany.
Top Row: GDP by sector
Bottom Row: Labour force by occupation
Austria
agriculture: 1.7%; industry: 32.3%; services: 65.8%
agriculture: 5.5%; industry: 27.5%; services: 67% (2005 est.)
Germany
agriculture: 0.9%, industry: 29.1%, services: 70% (2012 est.)
agriculture (2,4%), industry (29,7%), services (67,8%) (2005)
UK
Agriculture: 0.6%; Construction: 6.4%; Production: 14.6%; Services: 78.4 (2014 est.)
Agriculture: 1.5%; Industry: 18.8%; Services: 79.7% (2011 est.)
See that pathetic number in blue down the bottom? That's the failure of the UK vis-a-vis Germany. That's dumb, frictionless capital whipping in and out and doing nothing to build a serious middle class. When you think one solid job supports four people, that extra 10% in industrial employment is the difference between the most HQ countries, and the chest-beating also-rans who fantasise they're the best.
And these twits want to build trade walls which will hit manufacturing above all other industries! I mean, wow; sheer geniuses! They can't compete with Gemrnay, so they pack up their bat and ball and close the borders. How pathetic; like that's going to fix anything!
Sure, it could work. As I say, invading Iraq could've worked. But there were way too many unknowns, way too many big forces at play, way too much ignorance of the task and its implications, way too many spurious motives, way too many irrational emotions, way too many weak leaders with their own interests in mind, and way too many thugs with ulterior motives, and such, driving the Iraq War for it to be anything but a grossly negligent human gamble.
Just as it is with the BRainlessExit.
One day, you'll discover that serious decisions concerning other people's lives and well-being simply need to be separated from the voices of ill-treatment in our heads, as real as the injury to our emotional system is.
I bet you didn't even realise you have just repeated one of the great Iraq War arguments, almost verbatim: "Oh, but yours is just an opinion". Indeed, but I'm not the one proposing radical change. The onus is on the interveners to justify themselves, just as it was with Iraq.
Sure, a BRainlessExit could end marvellously well for all. It could. The Iraq invasion could've ended up all well and good, too. It could have.
But could is insufficient reason to undertake massive, high-risk changes at sensitive moments in history.
The US is weakening, and has little more to add than to negotiate with China. From Russia to Ukraine to Turkey to North Africa, Europe is surrounded by very unstable forces. This instability is going to worsen as the likes of Russia, Saudi Arabia and Iran thrash like cut snakes as the use of oil declines, and with it their economies.
Meanwhile, zero of Britain's challenges related to Europe. Zero. Britain is struggling to generate sufficient revenue to hold up its already mid-pack quality of life; links with European industry only support its efforts to rely less on the financial sector. NATO is an EU security blanket that benefits the UK, especially with the US focusing on the Pacific.
Disconnected money flows which have no regard for cities or countries as homes for human beings, such as those which power the London Financial District, have nothing more to add to Britain. Nothing. Zip. Zero. They're already too big a part of the economy, as the GFC demonstrated. Britain needs GDP that looks a lot more German, and a lot less Wall Street.
And yet, there are the BRainlessExiters building barriers with manufacturers across Europe. There they are hand-wringing as the millions of refugees its dumb ignore-Europe-and-partner-with-the-USA wars caused suffer and die, or join terrorist militias. There they are, making things more murky and complicated even as their own government slashes social budgets in a country whose quality of life is already behind the leading EU countries.
I was studying Austria today just for the heck of it, as I was playing a guessing game as to its main economic drivers. So, I usually ask the Beloved, or she asks me, to guess the composition of their economic output. I got forestry and paper, and manufactures going over the border to Germany, such as auto parts, right, as well as the easy one, skiing (tourism).
Then, I got to my 'ole favourite, expecting Austria to have about 10% higher GDP and employment associated with its manufacturing sector, as with Germany.
Top Row: GDP by sector
Bottom Row: Labour force by occupation
Austria
agriculture: 1.7%; industry: 32.3%; services: 65.8%
agriculture: 5.5%; industry: 27.5%; services: 67% (2005 est.)
Germany
agriculture: 0.9%, industry: 29.1%, services: 70% (2012 est.)
agriculture (2,4%), industry (29,7%), services (67,8%) (2005)
UK
Agriculture: 0.6%; Construction: 6.4%; Production: 14.6%; Services: 78.4 (2014 est.)
Agriculture: 1.5%; Industry: 18.8%; Services: 79.7% (2011 est.)
See that pathetic number in blue down the bottom? That's the failure of the UK vis-a-vis Germany. That's dumb, frictionless capital whipping in and out and doing nothing to build a serious middle class. When you think one solid job supports four people, that extra 10% in industrial employment is the difference between the most HQ countries, and the chest-beating also-rans who fantasise they're the best.
And these twits want to build trade walls which will hit manufacturing above all other industries! I mean, wow; sheer geniuses! They can't compete with Gemrnay, so they pack up their bat and ball and close the borders. How pathetic; like that's going to fix anything!
Sure, it could work. As I say, invading Iraq could've worked. But there were way too many unknowns, way too many big forces at play, way too much ignorance of the task and its implications, way too many spurious motives, way too many irrational emotions, way too many weak leaders with their own interests in mind, and way too many thugs with ulterior motives, and such, driving the Iraq War for it to be anything but a grossly negligent human gamble.
Just as it is with the BRainlessExit.
In the end the rain comes down, washes clean the streets of a blue sky town.
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think positive
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you asked me what i meant, i explained myself, you totally ignored what i wrote, and come back with a load of google research about Austria!
as for where where the "opinion" comment has been used before, wowee, i bet they used it back in the day of Cleopatra too!! it is just your opinion, and other peoples opinions deserve to be heard, and strangely enough, they prefer to to tell it without receiving a load of verbal abuse, no matter how amusing you might think that abuse is.
life would be pretty boring if we all thought the same way. life is a constant lesson, and my opinion is you could do with a lesson in how to win friends and influence people. feel free to disagree.
but, hey, way to prove my point!! thanks and cheers
as for where where the "opinion" comment has been used before, wowee, i bet they used it back in the day of Cleopatra too!! it is just your opinion, and other peoples opinions deserve to be heard, and strangely enough, they prefer to to tell it without receiving a load of verbal abuse, no matter how amusing you might think that abuse is.
life would be pretty boring if we all thought the same way. life is a constant lesson, and my opinion is you could do with a lesson in how to win friends and influence people. feel free to disagree.
but, hey, way to prove my point!! thanks and cheers
You cant fix stupid, turns out you cant quarantine it either!