To member,
I am impressed with your knowledge of the inner workings of the draft, but I will pull you up on one point. At no time was Danny Roach considered a top 10 draft choice. By his own admission, he had a poor U/18 carnival, playing in the b division, played very average over a 2 year stint with the Mariners and was considered to be a fair way behind his best mate Brad Green. Judkins himself said that he can develope into a good footballer, and that he is a bit of a project player. I can tell you that one other club that I have friends at (in the Football dept.) didn't rate Roach in the top 20 for the '99 draft, and were surprised we took him so high.
That is fact!
Judkins
Moderator: bbmods
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Kate
Oh Rohan,
I am again embarrassed for you and your supposed knowledge of the "inner workings" of the club and apparent 'facts' about why this or that happened, why so and so did this, who said what, and what is actually true.
I'm sure your brother's mates' cousin's best friend has whispered a couple of gems your way- and I just know you're one of those righteous knobs who takes it as gospel and jumps on their soap box with quotes like "well I went to uni with him, so he MUST have told ME the full story...." or "My cousin slept with his manager's dog..." and "I know what REALLY happened because some other tool told me so (because he wants to sound like he has any idea by big noting himself)".
I am quite frankly embarrassed at what you have claimed as fact and your preaching about "what actually happens differs from what we hear in the press..." argument. Because you would know, of all people. I am sure that football's biggest power players would be running to you to confide in and let in on all the juicy gossip, so you can come snivelling to the Forum with it.
I can assure you that the "facts" you have let us in on are complete crap and nothing more than the stories people who PRETEND to be in the know spread just so they have have a slightly different version so people assume it must be the 'real' truth.
It may surprise you to learn that the rest of us are not actually loser supporters who sit here just hoping that someone with a club connection will give us the 'inside scoop'- a lot of people have more knowledgable connections than you may think, and I don't mean someone's mate who knows someone who once talked to a player involved who told them some bullshit to shut them up.
Melbourne- Australia for that matter, isn't that big. Pretty much everyone knows someone, or is related to someone who does or has played footy. It's just that the rest of the population don't assume we all of a sudden know 'the real story about what goes on'- we have the discretion and brains to shut up.
[This message has been edited by Kate (edited 24 July 2001).]
I am again embarrassed for you and your supposed knowledge of the "inner workings" of the club and apparent 'facts' about why this or that happened, why so and so did this, who said what, and what is actually true.
I'm sure your brother's mates' cousin's best friend has whispered a couple of gems your way- and I just know you're one of those righteous knobs who takes it as gospel and jumps on their soap box with quotes like "well I went to uni with him, so he MUST have told ME the full story...." or "My cousin slept with his manager's dog..." and "I know what REALLY happened because some other tool told me so (because he wants to sound like he has any idea by big noting himself)".
I am quite frankly embarrassed at what you have claimed as fact and your preaching about "what actually happens differs from what we hear in the press..." argument. Because you would know, of all people. I am sure that football's biggest power players would be running to you to confide in and let in on all the juicy gossip, so you can come snivelling to the Forum with it.
I can assure you that the "facts" you have let us in on are complete crap and nothing more than the stories people who PRETEND to be in the know spread just so they have have a slightly different version so people assume it must be the 'real' truth.
It may surprise you to learn that the rest of us are not actually loser supporters who sit here just hoping that someone with a club connection will give us the 'inside scoop'- a lot of people have more knowledgable connections than you may think, and I don't mean someone's mate who knows someone who once talked to a player involved who told them some bullshit to shut them up.
Melbourne- Australia for that matter, isn't that big. Pretty much everyone knows someone, or is related to someone who does or has played footy. It's just that the rest of the population don't assume we all of a sudden know 'the real story about what goes on'- we have the discretion and brains to shut up.
[This message has been edited by Kate (edited 24 July 2001).]
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Member
- Posts: 133
- Joined: Wed Jul 26, 2000 6:01 pm
To Legga,
I apologise for the context that I put Danny Roach in.
I do agree with you and I guess at the time Danny was seen as versatile player that had the potential to be good in a few years.
My aim was to highlight that he was part of an intricate deal at the time.
I must say so far Danny has been a dissappointment, but it is always easy in hindsight. If we can get many picks correct and not many wrong then we are heading in the right direction.
My objection has been with Rohan attack on Judkins which I think is unfair. He is a quality person and astute judge of young players, and his team of people are fantastic.
I was trying to explain to Rohan that Judkins had no influence on some issues that he brought up.
I guess I still wonder if Rohan has a problem with Judkins or just the fact that the previous football coach and assistants made some mistakes. I guess I will never know unless I meet Rohan and he tells me.
thanks Legga
I apologise for the context that I put Danny Roach in.
I do agree with you and I guess at the time Danny was seen as versatile player that had the potential to be good in a few years.
My aim was to highlight that he was part of an intricate deal at the time.
I must say so far Danny has been a dissappointment, but it is always easy in hindsight. If we can get many picks correct and not many wrong then we are heading in the right direction.
My objection has been with Rohan attack on Judkins which I think is unfair. He is a quality person and astute judge of young players, and his team of people are fantastic.
I was trying to explain to Rohan that Judkins had no influence on some issues that he brought up.
I guess I still wonder if Rohan has a problem with Judkins or just the fact that the previous football coach and assistants made some mistakes. I guess I will never know unless I meet Rohan and he tells me.
thanks Legga
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Millane42
- Posts: 1120
- Joined: Fri Aug 18, 2000 6:01 pm
- Location: Sydney
Read the article by garry lyon yesterday on afl.com (he is a more reliable and respected source than rohan, someone who has been an AFL champ) and he argues that the platform has been built and whatever happens for the rest of this season is a bonus because we will reap the rewards for the next 4-5 years out of it (if not more). He praises both MM and coaching staff, and JUDKINS for the good recruiting of the young kids and the experienced ones from other clubs like molloy, clement, etc. Case closed.
C'mon PIES - Stick together to topple the AFL Empire.
C'mon PIES - Stick together to topple the AFL Empire.
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Rohan Coventry Tateson
The point of my argument is have Judkins and co maximized the draft choices we have had and maximized the return for the players we have given away.
I argued a case for Judkin's. Quality picks have been Lonie, Nick Davis, Fraser, Tarrant, Leon Davis and Didak.
I also stated that Molloy, Steinfort, Holland and Clement had all been good pick up's too. However I am not going to say these are recruiting success's yet because they are only 16 games into their Collingwood careers. You only have to look at how Tyson Lane had a great start in 99, yet has failed to deliver since.
What made me critical of Judkins is that there have been some serious mistakes that have been swept under the carpet.
Sure he recruited those youngsters that I highlighted, but where they so hard to pick up in the first place? They where all taken with our first pick and where very high in the draft (Lonie, Neon the exceptions). Give any AFL recruiter the picks what he has been given and I am sure they could produce the same results.
That took me onto comparing him with other recruiting scouts.
I stated Noel Judkins is a talent scout and the best way to determine how he's going is not list the duds, but compare his picks to the other club.
Examples of this include Roach being taken at 7. At the same time Cupido and Brown were taken. At 19 he took Shaw and around this time Burton, Green and Spriggs were taken. In 98 we took Oborne at 35, yet Dragevic, Jacobs and Fevola were taken. In 97 he drafted Wasley at 24, yet Simon Black, Nick Stevens and Clem Michael were taken
When you compare it you can see that it doesn't look too good. Sure Judkins has recruited well, but has any recruiter had better draft picks than he has had in the last 4 years?
May the St Kevin's Old Boys Prevail.
I argued a case for Judkin's. Quality picks have been Lonie, Nick Davis, Fraser, Tarrant, Leon Davis and Didak.
I also stated that Molloy, Steinfort, Holland and Clement had all been good pick up's too. However I am not going to say these are recruiting success's yet because they are only 16 games into their Collingwood careers. You only have to look at how Tyson Lane had a great start in 99, yet has failed to deliver since.
What made me critical of Judkins is that there have been some serious mistakes that have been swept under the carpet.
Sure he recruited those youngsters that I highlighted, but where they so hard to pick up in the first place? They where all taken with our first pick and where very high in the draft (Lonie, Neon the exceptions). Give any AFL recruiter the picks what he has been given and I am sure they could produce the same results.
That took me onto comparing him with other recruiting scouts.
I stated Noel Judkins is a talent scout and the best way to determine how he's going is not list the duds, but compare his picks to the other club.
Examples of this include Roach being taken at 7. At the same time Cupido and Brown were taken. At 19 he took Shaw and around this time Burton, Green and Spriggs were taken. In 98 we took Oborne at 35, yet Dragevic, Jacobs and Fevola were taken. In 97 he drafted Wasley at 24, yet Simon Black, Nick Stevens and Clem Michael were taken
When you compare it you can see that it doesn't look too good. Sure Judkins has recruited well, but has any recruiter had better draft picks than he has had in the last 4 years?
May the St Kevin's Old Boys Prevail.
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Danzy Rocks!!!
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