Post match. Pies thumped by Port. All comments please.

[MatthewBoydFanClub]

It's interesting that people here are using injuries as the cause of our insipid display yesterday. Injuries are a cause for being beaten by a better team. They are not the cause for poor effort, tackles slipping, poor decision making and failure to cover space when defending. Our own coach is not blaming injuries so why should we?
We had four guys out there yesterday who hadn't played for the club before this year who were showing up the rest of the team; Cox, Smith, Howe and Treloar. Howe played with a bung knee and was almost our best player. Another three were returning from an injury wrecked 2015. They were Reid, Sinclair and Greenwood. Those seven players made up our best players yesterday. Pendlebury can hold his head up high. That's eight. Crocker and Goodyear being first year players can be excused. Maybe add to that number Blair, who had a dreadful start to the year and has fought back gallantly to make a positive contribution to the team despite limited ability. That's half a team contributing. No wonder we're losing.
As far as I'm concerned we have half the team either having gone backwards this year, or stayed the same. That raises alarm bells to me because if we put it all down to injuries we accept mediocrity at this club. Particularly disturbing to me is that we have a couple of players at the club who have dropped off so much they need to start questioning whether they should still have AFL careers next year. Blair answered the question for himself a few weeks back by fighting back and playing well. It about time a few of the others start fighting back to save their careers.

[Bob Sugar]

Buckley is not getting the best out of the players, **** him off ASAP.

[melliot]

This year is a disaster by any definition.

we all see things differently.

you may have been happy making finals or even being bridesmaid again.

I would prefer we get games into kids and push hard in 2017 and 2018 (when our chances will be more realistic), with Josh Thomas and Keefe to be ready made next year.

I disagree respectfully about us having too many of Josh Thomas' type as he is a clearance specialist and we don't have many.

I've never said Josh Thomas wasn't a good inclusion. We need in and unders desperately. Losing Adams shows that.

What part of this year has been a success?

Playing kids? Inserting kids in a side that resembles a headless chook, can't be good for development. And can make their development slower. They're not being taught by enough good senior players.

[Bob Sugar]

How can we play more kids when considering the number of players who have represented the club this year. Just about everyone who is fit is getting a game.

An how the hell can injuries not be a factor in our performance. Do you honestly think we would be performing so poorly if we had our best and most talented 22 fit and in form for the full season and pre season. Even the injuries sustained by some of our younger players has had a major impact on their development and preseason preparation.

As an example do you honestly think Crocker is having equal impact to what a fit and in form Jamie Elliott would have. Is Dane Swan's replacement having as much impact?

A disappointing and frustrating year by all account but how about a bit of balance.

Injurie excuse again? 5 years in a row? Under Buckley we have consistently been the most injury prone team in the comp, it'll be the same next year if we keep him, now I dont care if he's over training the players-Micks using a voodoo doll or he's simply the most unluckiest coach in the history of sport, enough is enough.

[thompsoc]

Maybe we're all getting a little but wary of all these new contributors who come rushing in to immediately bag our coach and Club.

I know I am.

OK, but you still have to consider their points objectively. I think lots of passionate Collingwood supporters are questioning our coaching. I know that I am one.

Happy for posters to post objective critisism, much of it though is vitriolic vomit and nothing more than the continuation of a hate agenda, and largely baseless and founded on ignorance and denial of mitigating factors.

gastro man no. 1
And Jackcass it is criticism not critisism.
For a person who is Mr Right I will quote Ma Kettle... " i'm surprised at your learning"

[thompsoc]

At the end of their playing and coaching careers I will show more respect to Travis Cloke than Nathan Buckley.

1 was able to be a key player in a premiership and the other has been the captain and coach of two of our worst eras.

I think you're rewriting history there. Our 'worst era' with Buckley as captain included two grand final appearances, playing finals in 06 and 07 and a finishing very close to finals in other years. Our only shocking years were 99 and 2000, immediately after he took over. If anything, Buckleys captaincy coincided with the long term rebuild of the entire club.

Jez never lets facts get in the way of his vomit. Largely why he's posting under a new name I think.

gastro man 2.
How about some non abuse for a change

[HAL]

OK, but you still have to consider their points objectively. I think lots of passionate Collingwood supporters are questioning our coaching. I know that I am one.

Happy for posters to post objective critisism, much of it though is vitriolic vomit and nothing more than the continuation of a hate agenda, and largely baseless and founded on ignorance and denial of mitigating factors.

gastro man no. 1

You claim to be one.

[R_T_RUSH]

I am not a member only a barracker living in NSW. I don't get close to people within the club. I only form my opinions from watching many games on 7mate and listening to ABC and SEN radio plus spending time following AFL on the AFL website.
I agree with those who say our weakness starts with coach Bucks. I think he is a good skills teacher, but he hasn't a AFL standard game plan. I don't think he talks right for the battlefield. He is too sophisticated for a fast and furious type of game....it takes too long for what he says to sink in. I also don't like how he bags the players effort all the time. To my observation, the players are not in-sync with the game plan. I suggest that this effort bagging is demoralising & demotivating.
If the players do not believe in the game plan, its very demanding physically to run your guts out back and forth for a perceived bad game plan. I also suspect that the players are divided, probably between old and new and more possibly involving Travis Cloke.
We need to play SMARTER....starting at the TOP....that means our Mr Buckley if he is up to it.

Career highlights
Club

Brownlow Medal: 2003
7x All-Australian team: 1996-2001, 2003
6x Collingwood Best & Fairest: 1994, 1996, 1998-2000, 2003
Norm Smith Medal: 2002
Collingwood Captain: 1999-2007
Collingwood Team of the Century
AFLCA Champion Player of the Year: 2003
AFL Rising Star: 1993
Magarey Medal: 1992
Jack Oatey Medal: 1992
Port Adelaide (SANFL) premiership player (1992)
Port Adelaide (SANFL) best and fairest (1992)
Representative

Jesaulenko Medal: 1997
Captain of the Allies: 1997
Hey Twiggy!!! When you've done THIS Give us a call.In the mean time stick to rugby league.

That list of accolades is exactly the reason for the current mess.

Luke Beveridge was a development at the club 2009-20010.

Was he interviewed for the handover role?

[3rd degree]

Very hard watching yesterday thank god Chop was playing one of our smarter players. Cox tried hard all day , but over possessing from our midfield was shocking and decision making made me lose chest hair. Tragic to see how far we have fallen away from where we were against geelong and footscray two weeks before.

[Museman]

The age profile of our side and the then adding Treloar, Greenwood and Howe to the mix is a good reason to suspect it would take us longer than 2016 to make the 8 as players need time to get to know how each other operate on match day.

To say we have 'severley underporformed' is remarkable given we are the only club to have used 35 players, and mainly NOT BY CHOICE.

If you look at he outs - bloody oath some are stars - Adams has become an A grader and general of our defence. Missed 3 games and will miss many more.

Fasolo - an elite medium forward by any measure.

Moore - Number 1 key forward and 2nd leading goalkicker who is much more mobile and athletic than Cloke and puts on great defensive pressure.

Swan - brownlow medallist that can turn games.

Langdon - one of the best intercept marks in the AFL.

Elliott - elite medium forward.

Howe - missed 2 games due to injury and took another 3 or so to adjust to AFL pace and our structures.

Reid missed 1 or 2?

Varcoe missed 2 games - A grader.

Sidebottom missed the first 2 and another 1 (Carlton) for being suspended.

Pendlebury played with a rib injury and has only started to come good the last 4 - 5 weeks.

Cloke can't get near it and when he does can't hit the side of a barn shed.

Treloar had no preseason.

Scharenberg can't get a clean run and is a Rolls Royce if he does.

Ramsay was critical to our backline with his run, kicking ability, speed and pressure. He is our first choice medium backman ahead of Williams and Sinclair.

In light of all of the above, how have we SEVERLEY UNDERPERFORMED and how could we POSSIBLY have done any better?

Fact 1, Scharenberg is not a rolls royce, hes a young injury plagued footballer who has played a whopping 4 games.

Fact 2, you are full of chit, evidence required? see fact 1.

[HAL]

What is a rolls royce hes a young injury plagued footballer who has played a whopping 4 games?

[Daniel]

The age profile of our side and the then adding Treloar, Greenwood and Howe to the mix is a good reason to suspect it would take us longer than 2016 to make the 8 as players need time to get to know how each other operate on match day.

To say we have 'severley underporformed' is remarkable given we are the only club to have used 35 players, and mainly NOT BY CHOICE.

If you look at he outs - bloody oath some are stars - Adams has become an A grader and general of our defence. Missed 3 games and will miss many more.

Fasolo - an elite medium forward by any measure.

Moore - Number 1 key forward and 2nd leading goalkicker who is much more mobile and athletic than Cloke and puts on great defensive pressure.

Swan - brownlow medallist that can turn games.

Langdon - one of the best intercept marks in the AFL.

Elliott - elite medium forward.

Howe - missed 2 games due to injury and took another 3 or so to adjust to AFL pace and our structures.

Reid missed 1 or 2?

Varcoe missed 2 games - A grader.

Sidebottom missed the first 2 and another 1 (Carlton) for being suspended.

Pendlebury played with a rib injury and has only started to come good the last 4 - 5 weeks.

Cloke can't get near it and when he does can't hit the side of a barn shed.

Treloar had no preseason.

Scharenberg can't get a clean run and is a Rolls Royce if he does.

Ramsay was critical to our backline with his run, kicking ability, speed and pressure. He is our first choice medium backman ahead of Williams and Sinclair.

In light of all of the above, how have we SEVERLEY UNDERPERFORMED and how could we POSSIBLY have done any better?

Fact 1, Scharenberg is not a rolls royce, hes a young injury plagued footballer who has played a whopping 4 games.

Fact 2, you are full of chit, evidence required? see fact 1.

Fact 3 - don't confuse opinions with FACTS, as opinions are like arseholes, everyone has one

[jackcass]

You can bet your bottom dollar that the club will spin the injury line for the remainder of the year. It's all this club does now, it should be a PR firm or a political party rather than a football club. Infact I have already received an email from a club employee (I am happy to show it to a moderator to validate it) that they will use that narrative to defend their poor performance.

35 players used, more than any other club is FACT, not SPIN.

I think you believed a lot of SPIN at the beginning of the year, when FACT was we were unlikely to make top 8, even without injury - given the age of our list and lack of time playing together.

I disagree with your assessment of the situation. While we were never going to win the premiership this year we had every reason to think we had the makings on a final 8 side, given who we recruited and an extra year of development in our younger players. For one reason or another it hasn't worked out that way and now it's all about salvaging what's left in the year. But by any measure we have severely underperformed so far this season and our ambitions of challenging for a premiership in 2017 or 2018 are under threat. We therefore need to have a thorough assessment of where it all went wrong at the end of the year to determine what we need to do to get it right next year. We just can't accept failure any longer but scapegoating any particular individual for that failure is not going to solve anything.

Disagree. Think you'll find a fairly significant proportion of posters actually nominated pretty broad ranges in likely finishing place. Myself, I thought 5 -10. That doesn't project "every reason to think we had the makings of a final 8 side" but allows that if everything goes right we could. Not too much has gone right. Losing Swanny minutes into game 1 likely set the tone. I still haven't completely ruled out the potential of finals in 2016, but it does become less likely with every loss.

[jackcass]

The age profile of our side and the then adding Treloar, Greenwood and Howe to the mix is a good reason to suspect it would take us longer than 2016 to make the 8 as players need time to get to know how each other operate on match day.

To say we have 'severley underporformed' is remarkable given we are the only club to have used 35 players, and mainly NOT BY CHOICE.

If you look at he outs - bloody oath some are stars - Adams has become an A grader and general of our defence. Missed 3 games and will miss many more.

Fasolo - an elite medium forward by any measure.

Moore - Number 1 key forward and 2nd leading goalkicker who is much more mobile and athletic than Cloke and puts on great defensive pressure.

Swan - brownlow medallist that can turn games.

Langdon - one of the best intercept marks in the AFL.

Elliott - elite medium forward.

Howe - missed 2 games due to injury and took another 3 or so to adjust to AFL pace and our structures.

Reid missed 1 or 2?

Varcoe missed 2 games - A grader.

Sidebottom missed the first 2 and another 1 (Carlton) for being suspended.

Pendlebury played with a rib injury and has only started to come good the last 4 - 5 weeks.

Cloke can't get near it and when he does can't hit the side of a barn shed.

Treloar had no preseason.

Scharenberg can't get a clean run and is a Rolls Royce if he does.

Ramsay was critical to our backline with his run, kicking ability, speed and pressure. He is our first choice medium backman ahead of Williams and Sinclair.

In light of all of the above, how have we SEVERLEY UNDERPERFORMED and how could we POSSIBLY have done any better?

It's actually 36 players and only 6 who have played every game. GCS actually jumped us on the weekend moving to 37.

Varcoe has only played 6 games thus far in 2016.

Carlton who some have suggested have passed us by have used 31 and have 8 players who have played every game.

[Johnno75]

Is there a stat for most goals conceded from the goal square?

Reckon we would be ranked No. 1....

Joe the goose would love playing against us.