Post Match. Giants down Pies - All comments please

[think positive]

That is interesting Jezza.
Do you think we can close that gap?

Seriously, if we had traded for even one of the two KPPs we had lost, we could be in the eight. No forward thinking.

When MM knew the pressure was on him, he traded for Jolly and Ball, the rest is history. Wells isn't bad, but he's still a hook up centre player, god knows if Mayne is any good, lot of money for a VFL player. Every time I see that fat little red head kick s goal on onother team I shakes me head!

[Culprit]

We lost the game when Dunn kicked to a contest instead of maintaining possession with short kicks to a team mate. You run the clock clock down with a minute left on the clock, that is what you do in our game and especially when you are a point up. It's basic football, even at Junior Level.

GWS had a 2 man bench which went to 1 in the last quarter. We should have won but we didn't and that's simply another nail in the coaches coffin. It's not a matter of IF but WHEN. It's going to get ugly.

[melliot]

^
He may be right, he may be wrong.

What I do know is right is that KM and a lot of his mates blame Buckley for everything under the sun. What I also know is right is that Buckley is not on the ground during play. What I also know is right is that too much blame is apportioned to a coach when things aren't going well and too much credit is given to a coach when things are going well.

What I also know is right that the old coach he keeps rabbiting on about is a self centred and egotistical man, who thinks everything is about him. If I was in charge of the club, I would have sacked him after his Footy Show interview in late 2011.

What I also know is right is that the old coach won 3 flags in 30 odd years, two of them with the WA state side. What I also know is right is the old coach was one of the worst game day and tactical coaches in the history of the game.

However, I agree with you it is extremely frustrating watching us play at the minute, it is pull your hair out stuff.

I'm a MM fan myself. For all his faults (eg 2011 dummy spit), that team was well organised more often than not.

Our current team doesn't know which side is up. It is almost for the last 3-4 year's we've gradually become more disorganised on feild. And for that reason I can observe myself, I think Bux should have been moved on almost 12 months ago.

[thompsoc]

^Everything's Buckley's fault isn't it. You probably blame him if we lose the coin toss at the start of the game.

Change the channel, Krakouer.

Could it be as simple as that Moore is a 30 game player that may have been in such a position only once or twice in his career and panicked. If he was a 130 game player, he is more likely to have made a different decision. I suppose not because this goes against your mission of ensuring Buckley is sacked.

it is called scoreboard mooretreloar.
So I see you are playing the inexperience card and the luck card again.
We had a young side in the 2010 GF, didn't matter under MM.

[makri]

^Everything's Buckley's fault isn't it. You probably blame him if we lose the coin toss at the start of the game.

Change the channel, Krakouer.

Could it be as simple as that Moore is a 30 game player that may have been in such a position only once or twice in his career and panicked. If he was a 130 game player, he is more likely to have made a different decision. I suppose not because this goes against your mission of ensuring Buckley is sacked.

it is called scoreboard mooretreloar.
So I see you are playing the inexperience card and the luck card again.
We had a young side in the 2010 GF, didn't matter under MM.

Baby bombers in 1993....

[mooretreloar]

How did Mr Malthouse go at Carlton?

Yes melliot, the team was well drilled under Malthouse. He was also a sensational man manager.

However, his game day coaching and tactical nous on game day were as poor as I have seen in my time of watching football. This cost us multiple games, including the 2011 premiership, with his crowning moment in the 2011 GF: to sub Blair when he was fit and leave Reid on, who couldn't move.

thompsoc, your comments do not deserve a proper response, except to say please go and barrack for another team.

[think positive]

How did Mr Malthouse go at Carlton?

Yes melliot, the team was well drilled under Malthouse. He was also a sensational man manager.

However, his game day coaching and tactical nous on game day were as poor as I have seen in my time of watching football. This cost us multiple games, including the 2011 premiership, with his crowning moment in the 2011 GF: to sub Blair when he was fit and leave Reid on, who couldn't move.

thompsoc, your comments do not deserve a proper response, except to say please go and barrack for another team.

hang on, didnt you say the coach has no impact on game day??

and truth is that carlton team was crap, no coach could have won with them, and the previous coach got way more out of them thtn he had a right to, he was shafted big time in my opinion.

as for the game, it wasnt Blair slip, it wasnt dunns fault, hell even that shit umpire could not have touched us if we were further in front. how many set shots missed? cant blame that on inexperience, its not an on the run shot, and they should all be dunking them by the time they hit AFL level, hell the orange boy could have hit some of them.

and that last line, go barrack elsewhere? everyone has a right to an opinion, even if they are as wrong as you sometimes are


*thats bait, you taking it!

[piedys]

Biggest losing margin so far:

Western Bulldogs - 16
Collingwood - 23

It obviously doesn't tell the full story about the game plan and our W-L record, but I found this stat interesting nevertheless.

Jez, good observations; it's been a tipsters nightmare this season.
The middle of the table is a logjam and is likely to remain so until at least the halfway point, or soon after.
The ladder won't really take shape until everybody has played each other once, or near enough.
It's very rare that you see a team with a percentage of 90+, that far down the gurglar.

Save for Blair's sheer and utter ineptitude in the final minute, we'd be sitting in 12th spot with hope, and back amongst the pack.
Great selection coach - serves you right for picking your "little mate".
We now have bogey team Whorethorn to conquer, and three on-ball players pending a return to the 22.

[thompsoc]

Biggest losing margin so far:

Western Bulldogs - 16
Collingwood - 23

It obviously doesn't tell the full story about the game plan and our W-L record, but I found this stat interesting nevertheless.

Jez, good observations; it's been a tipsters nightmare this season.
The middle of the table is a logjam and is likely to remain so until at least the halfway point, or soon after.
The ladder won't really take shape until everybody has played each other once, or near enough.
It's very rare that you see a team with a percentage of 90+, that far down the gurglar.

Save for Blair's sheer and utter ineptitude in the final minute, we'd be sitting in 12th spot with hope, and back amongst the pack.
Great selection coach - serves you right for picking your "little mate".
We now have bogey team Whorethorn to conquer, and three on-ball players pending a return to the 22.

Yep
the flag is there for the taking from any side that shows form over a period of time.

[piedys]

Yep
the flag is there for the taking from any side that shows form over a period of time.

Even so, i'd be confident that the 2017 top four would eventually comprise the Crows, Port, GWS, the footscray. I don't think we are going to get another team storming home from outside the top four two years running.

[Krakouer Magic]

^
He may be right, he may be wrong.

What I do know is right is that KM and a lot of his mates blame Buckley for everything under the sun. What I also know is right is that Buckley is not on the ground during play. What I also know is right is that too much blame is apportioned to a coach when things aren't going well and too much credit is given to a coach when things are going well.

What I also know is right that the old coach he keeps rabbiting on about is a self centred and egotistical man, who thinks everything is about him. If I was in charge of the club, I would have sacked him after his Footy Show interview in late 2011.

What I also know is right is that the old coach won 3 flags in 30 odd years, two of them with the WA state side. What I also know is right is the old coach was one of the worst game day and tactical coaches in the history of the game.

However, I agree with you it is extremely frustrating watching us play at the minute, it is pull your hair out stuff.

I can't speak for the others in the anti Buckley brigade. But I certainly don't blame Buckley for everything under the sun. I just hold him accountable for disorganised on field leadership, poor overall game planning and inability to get the players to execute consistently.

I got plastered on here last year for saying the last second goal to Fitzpatrick in round 23 was a fundamental failure in coaching strategy and on field leadership to flood the backline at the bounce. People on here said it was just bad luck. It wasn't, and I was right. Have a look at what gws did on Saturday night after they got up with 38 on the clock. Most of their players were in the defensive half. I think Cameron was the only one.

Just like I'm right when I say the last 2 minutes of the swans game was piorly handled. Same as the one vs GWS. Howe had schade alone in the pocket. He chose the long bomb, one which was not close enough to the boundary to punch out. He could have also kicked to himself and schade could have blocked for him to get an extra 15 meters up down the line. It's panic stations in the dying minutes of games and when it keeps happening over and over again I put the onus on the coach. Either he is drilling the team poorly and they are disorganised or he is drilling them properly and they don't bother to listen. Either way, it's an indictment on the coach.

As for your thoughts on the previous coach. He may well be a self centred egotistical man. So what? What would you call a 38 year old person whose never coached before pushing to oust a proven quality coach? A guess that 38 year old is just the epitome of selflessness and akin to Jesus?

See you can have a crack at malthouse and it's ok because that's the narrative you want to spin. But god forbid you use the same assessment on Buckley. All I know is our former coach was very good at his job. The current one is not. The next coach better be a good one.

I gave Bucks almost 4 years unqualified support. I bought the lines about needing to change the playing culture. I bought into all the puff pieces in the media saying he had to get his list. And when I looked back what he'd actually achieved in his first 4 seasons I had absolutely zero examples of anything we did on field that resembled a quality football side. And funny enough it was a game vs Sydney that again we failed to close out in 2015 that I decided enough was enough. I made an objective decision that was based on what I saw on the field and read in the media. In regard to his coaching I care sweet FA for what he did as player.

When a simpleton such as myself can analyse and clearly explain the flaws in our structure every week then surely you've got to question the coach when the flaws are never fixed MT?

[ThePieMind]

Yep, never the coaches problem. Yet these systematic failures to finish teams off didn't happen every freaking week under the former coach.

Take the kick in from 1:10 on the clock for a start. If you want to be critical of the situation, which I always will be while Bucks is coach, the aim should have been to roost it down the boundary and punch it out 70m out. Now the execution of the kick went a little to far from the boundary for my liking. And then you have a roving Moore attempting to run and carry up the wing cause there was nothing to kick to up the ground. He hand passes to our ruckman we cough it up and Blair desperately slides into wards legs to kill the ball.

Under no circumstances would that have been acceptable under the former coach. Had Moore gone the handpass instead of roosting it down the line MM would have given him an almighty spray.

My point is, under pressure when your knackered you revert to things you have been drilled into you over the summer. And that my friends is the key problem. We resort to run and carry shit when the game is on the line because that's what the coach drills into players.

And that handpass to Grundy never happens under the old coach cause the old coach drilled kick first and hug the boundary every preseason. The ball had to be killed and taken out. It wasn't and we lost.

It's been ground hog day for 6 seasons now

You do realise that in order for the OLD coaches strategies to have been ingrained in our team for execution under pressure, we would have had to be playing his game plan.
And if we were playing the old game plan, we would have been 10 goals down, and not under pressure with 1 minute to go.

[ThePieMind]

FWIW I agree with KM. What he is explaining is only one example of failure of teaming/structure/team setup that fails too often.

We rarely win the tight one because of these fundamental issues.

I have plenty of examples of the team consistently not doing the simple things right. Or setting up right to how they want to play. For me when watching live, it is inexplicable frustration watching them play.

It is mostly a coaching problem IMO.

HAWKS won 6 game tight game last year.
WHY - experience, experience, experience.

When we have a core/ stable playing group that have played with each other for an extended period, these mistake will be far fewer.

I've sen BJ, Shaw and many others make fundamental errors in their early days - you can't buy experience, other wise it would be an expense item in every FD budget.

[ThePieMind]

FWIW I agree with KM. What he is explaining is only one example of failure of teaming/structure/team setup that fails too often.

We rarely win the tight one because of these fundamental issues.

I have plenty of examples of the team consistently not doing the simple things right. Or setting up right to how they want to play. For me when watching live, it is inexplicable frustration watching them play.

It is mostly a coaching problem IMO.

HAWKS won 6 games by less than a goal in 2016.
WHY - experience, experience, experience.

When we have a core/ stable playing group that have played with each other for an extended period, these mistake will be far fewer.

I've sen BJ, Shaw and many others make fundamental errors in their early days - you can't buy experience, other wise it would be an expense item in every FD budget.

[HAL]

I am not sure I agree with your assumptions, ThePieMind.