Justine Ruszczyk

[K]

Cop who shot Australian woman gets 12.5 years jail, apologises in court

https://www.theage.com.au/world/north-a ... 51vr4.html

[think positive]

Hopefully they protect him.

I wonder if the family is happy with that?

Did anyone see his family on the news? They had some good points.

[swoop42]

I don't get how someone can be guilty of both a murder and manslaughter charge.

Surely it should be one or the other as you can't kill someone twice.

I just hope that moving forward that all cops who shoot and kill face the same level of scrutiny as a black Muslim police officer did in killing an attractive affluent white woman.

[K]

^ It makes sense to charge someone with both if they qualify for both. The question then is just the sentencing.

[stui magpie]

It doesn't make sense under Australian Law, but this didn't happen in Australia.

[swoop42]

Why should he qualify for both though?

It seems like double dipping when there was only one act of shooting and one outcome of death.

[stui magpie]

I agree, but their law is different. Instead of being just charged with Murder or manslaughter, they have different degrees of both and can charge him with all of them if they want and get convictions on more than 1.

It doesn't make sense to me, you'd think that the highest charge wins and convict on that, but they do shit different in the US

[K]

Why should he qualify for both though?

It seems like double dipping when there was only one act of shooting and one outcome of death.

But what if someone is 100% guilty (no doubt at all from any jury) of a lesser charge and has 65% chance for a more serious charge? Do you want them to play safe or risk getting no conviction just because you don't like double dipping?

[stui magpie]

^

That's what happens under Australian law. (Or I should say various state laws). If you don't think you can nail the conviction for murder, you go for manslaughter instead, you can't do both.

[think positive]

I don't get how someone can be guilty of both a murder and manslaughter charge.

Surely it should be one or the other as you can't kill someone twice.

I just hope that moving forward that all cops who shoot and kill face the same level of scrutiny as a black Muslim police officer did in killing an attractive affluent white woman.

Exactly this

[Jezza]

I don't understand the US legal system, but one can't be charged with murder and manslaughter simultaneously in Australia.

Manslaughter lacks the mens rea (guilty mind) element that is existent in murder with both actus reus (guilty act) and mens rea (guilty mind) being the two elements required to prove a murder exists.

[stui magpie]

^

Like Australia it varies from state to state

[Jezza]

^ Very true. My primary understanding of the law is in the Victorian and Commonwealth jurisdiction.

I can't comment too much on other states.

[think positive]

no way in hell i believe this should be any sort of murder charge, no matter the definition (if you go back a few pages its explained) and i cant help feeling hes the scapegoat for a country screaming for police blood. Hes black, Shes white.unfortunately you dont have to look far for the opposite. Bang or no bang on the car, Im not convinced he had any malicious intent, so hes made a tragic mistake due to fear, being startled, i dont know. Hes human, its a whole different world over there, at night on a dark street. Its awful this poor lady dies while trying to help someone. And yes there are far too many times police who have accidentally shot an unarmed person, cant for the life of me understand why youd be a cop there, but thankfully there are a lot of people braver than me. I honestly dont know the answer, but in this case i dont think this is the right one. The clear vision of the black couple sitting in a car in Florida where the male is shot dead as his wife films and screams he has no weapon, that case had nothing to answer for. because its reasonable to assume a black man is a criminal?

these people need gun control now.

[stui magpie]

I'd be happy with him having no malicious intent, but he shot to kill, as he's trained to as a cop.

Luvdid covered it earlier.

Some clarity around the murder AND manslaughter guilty verdicts:

THE VERDICT

The verdicts were delivered one by one. In the days prior to reaching these verdicts, the jury heard definitions and explanations for each charge to help them decide whether he was guilty or not guilty of each.

Not guilty: 2nd Degree Murder: This was the most serious of the three charges for Noor. It is intentional murder but without premeditation.

The exact Definition as per court document is: “Under the laws of Minnesota, a person intentionally causing the death of another person, but without premeditation, is guilty of murder in the second degree.”

Guilty: 3rd Degree Murder: It is unintentional murder by acting eminently dangerously to others and evincing a depraved mind.

Exact Definition as per court document: “Under Minnesota law, a person causing the death of another by perpetrating an act eminently dangerous to others and without regard for human life, but without intent to cause the death of any person, is guilty of murder in the third degree.”

Guilty: 2nd Degree Manslaughter: This is causing someone’s death by culpable negligence.

Exact Definition as per court document: m “Under Minnesota law, whoever by culpable negligence, whereby he creates an unreasonable risk and consciously takes the chance of causing death or great bodily harm to another person, causes the death of another is guilty of manslaughter in the second degree.”

https://www.9news.com.au/world/justine- ... 6e7ec27faa

That you can be charged and convicted of 3 different degrees of a crime is a quirk of many US states laws that doesn't apply here