Coronavirus 4 - Kingdom of the Crystal Skull

[think positive]

Is it not true that a small - really small - percentage of people will have an adverse, and potentially deadly reaction to the virus? Can you then force someone to take that chance?

To the vaccine, I think you mean? Yes, of course. In terms of exercise of power, it is no different from sending an army off to war knowing that some of your soliders will be killed (save, of course, that chances are that way more of your soldiers will be killed since the point of a war seems to be to apply opposing lethal forces).

Speaking statistically, of course, we know that the chances of a dangerous reaction to the vaccine are a tiny fragment of the chances of a dangerous outcome if they get COVID, so that risk is irrelevant.

Their risk may be irrelevant to you but it might not be to them.

I'd love to see you explaining to an early 20's pregnant female terrified of what the vaccine might do to her baby that her risk is irrelevant and she has a moral obligation to get vaccinated to help protect you,

Good luck with that.

i know 3 ladies who were pregnant when they gotr the jabs, check out my chrissy shots, 3 perfectly gorgeous adorable little boys!!

they got it because they were choosing to protect their babies, scared of what could happen if they got covid while pregnant.

i still think that a lot of the hesitancy was caused by the almighty **** that AZ was when it was introduced, changing rules every second day is scary.

and there are an awful lot of folk who think doctor google is really concerned about their welfare!

[Pies4shaw]

^ As they should be - since that is a real risk and the other is so remote as to be irrelevant to any sensible decision-making.

[think positive]

Is it not true that a small - really small - percentage of people will have an adverse, and potentially deadly reaction to the virus? Can you then force someone to take that chance?

Well the Chief Health Officer of QLD said the vaccine is deadlier than Covid to anyone under 40...

never let the truth get in the way of a good story - you do realize posting bullshit like this is what is scaring people who just want to look for another excuse not to get it. just FYI in case you actually believe that statement to be true, she was talking about AZ, not all vaccines,

https://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/nation ... 585wt.html

[think positive]

i went to highpoint today, only cos i went to my doc who is more than half way there (I thought i broke my wrist, but its only soft tissue thank god!) ive been avoiding shopping centres like the, um plague, which is strangely appropriate! But i just wanted to celebrate some good news, and my non broken wrist, and off i went! i cannot believe how many people were totally mask free, not even chin masks. and how grateful the shop people were when your certificate was real. and yes i saw a few dickshits try it on! no where near as packed as i expected, parked in the closer carpark, in the furthest corner, and still a good 30 vacant spots when i got back to my car! 13 days to QLD, please please, keep that border open!

[Pies4shaw]

Here's some sample (published by the US National Safety Council) risks of death. From:

- opioid drug overdose - 1 in 88
- a fall - 1 in 106
- a car accident - 1 in 107
- gun assault - 1 in 289
- a pedestrian incident - 1 in 543
- riding a motorcycle - 1 in 899
- drowning - 1 in 1,128
- fire or smoke - 1 in 1,547
- choking on food - 1 in 2,542
- bicycling - 1 in 3,825
- sunstroke - 1 in 8,248
- a hornet, wasp or bee sting - 1 in 50,907

The risk of dying from the effects of an Astra-Zeneca vaccine is about 1 in 1,000,000, according to our Therapeutic Goods Administration: https://www1.racgp.org.au/newsgp/clinic ... ng-astraze

Try telling a pregnant woman who doesn't want to have a COVID vaccine because of the "risk" that she should, eg, stop driving or eating and see how far you get.

Just because some people hold completely irrational beliefs almost unshakeably doesn't mean that we should either: pander to them; or accommodate their madness; to the detriment of other people.

[stui magpie]

The cheese has slid off your cracker.

I know the science, I'm not an anti vaxxer, rational conversation doesn't overcome emotion.

Argue all you want, the unvaccinated will be freed soon. Bookmark it.

[What'sinaname]

i went to highpoint today, only cos i went to my doc who is more than half way there (I thought i broke my wrist, but its only soft tissue thank god!) ive been avoiding shopping centres like the, um plague, which is strangely appropriate! But i just wanted to celebrate some good news, and my non broken wrist, and off i went! i cannot believe how many people were totally mask free, not even chin masks. and how grateful the shop people were when your certificate was real. and yes i saw a few dickshits try it on! no where near as packed as i expected, parked in the closer carpark, in the furthest corner, and still a good 30 vacant spots when i got back to my car! 13 days to QLD, please please, keep that border open!

I find it interesting that, even after being fully vaxxed, we do things like this. What other vaccine have you or anyone taken whereby to ensure it works, you had to wear a mask and avoid people.

When you read this from the US Surgeon General Dr. Vivek Murthy:
If you "get vaccinated and boosted. You use testing judiciously before you gather, you gather in well-ventilated spaces and use masks whenever you can in public indoor spaces, your risk can be quite low and your holidays can be quite fulfilling.

Does that really sound like a vaccine that works?

[Pies4shaw]

Stui, the politics of it doesn't interest me. The collective mania of people who cling to their own anti-vax stupidity and, consequently, risk the welfare of others is not something that sensible people should tolerate.

W, the vaccine works very well (much better, as I understand it, than any seasonal flu vaccine typically does) - what it doesn't do is entirely eliminate the risk of infection or entirely stop transmissibility from a vaccinated person to other people. It halves - or better - the risk of transmission to others but if that takes the R0 from, say, 4 to 2 (or any other number at or above 1) it won't stop the pandemic. Hence, additional measures are required - both to eliminate the whole practical risk of becoming infected and to reduce further the risk of passing on the disease. Plainly, the best way to avoid getting seriously ill or dying from COVID is to avoid getting it. Roughly put, for every 10 vaccinated people, 1 will turn out not to have been properly protected - and while it is quite acceptable for public health planning decisions to be taken on the macro level (risk of serious illness or death is reduced by 90%), that doesn't spin so well at an individual level - if you're the 1 in 10, you're still dead.

[think positive]

i went to highpoint today, only cos i went to my doc who is more than half way there (I thought i broke my wrist, but its only soft tissue thank god!) ive been avoiding shopping centres like the, um plague, which is strangely appropriate! But i just wanted to celebrate some good news, and my non broken wrist, and off i went! i cannot believe how many people were totally mask free, not even chin masks. and how grateful the shop people were when your certificate was real. and yes i saw a few dickshits try it on! no where near as packed as i expected, parked in the closer carpark, in the furthest corner, and still a good 30 vacant spots when i got back to my car! 13 days to QLD, please please, keep that border open!

I find it interesting that, even after being fully vaxxed, we do things like this. What other vaccine have you or anyone taken whereby to ensure it works, you had to wear a mask and avoid people.

When you read this from the US Surgeon General Dr. Vivek Murthy:
If you "get vaccinated and boosted. You use testing judiciously before you gather, you gather in well-ventilated spaces and use masks whenever you can in public indoor spaces, your risk can be quite low and your holidays can be quite fulfilling.

Does that really sound like a vaccine that works?

It won’t happen over night but it will happen!

As P4S pointed out a page ago, give it time,

And also, my reaction as I’ve said here before I believe is partly lockdown PTSD! Plus I have a plane ticket to Qld in 12 days time!

[stui magpie]

Stui, the politics of it doesn't interest me. The collective mania of people who cling to their own anti-vax stupidity and, consequently, risk the welfare of others is not something that sensible people should tolerate..

The point I've been trying to make is that hurling insults at the collective unvaccinated and those opposing mandatory vaccination is neither accurate nor helpful.

yes, some are outright dingbats and mouth breathing conspiracy theorists, others are just ordinary people who for various reasons have made a choice. A choice I personally disagree with, but I'd prefer to try to understand and support rather than cast vitriol down my nose at them.

Public Health Orders that segregate the unvaccinated , denying them work or social outlets, cannot be some form of punishment for their decision, it can only be justified while there remains sufficient risk to life. Once that risk diminishes enough, which it will very soon, the orders will need to be rescinded.

[Pies4shaw]

There is no reasoned, viable basis for their position. It's nonsense. You may as well engage with flat-earthers. I'm not "casting vitriol down my nose" (that sounds quite dangerous, by the way) - I'm just trying to capture, adequately, the extent of their completely selfish, unacceptable lunacy. Theirs is a totally indefensible position and worthy of nothing other than extreme contempt. Their views - and they - are contemptible. We should say so. Instead, many amongst us appear to be deeply concerned to avoid the consequences of them holding their breath until they turn blue by giving in to what they want.

[think positive]

Stui, the politics of it doesn't interest me. The collective mania of people who cling to their own anti-vax stupidity and, consequently, risk the welfare of others is not something that sensible people should tolerate..

The point I've been trying to make is that hurling insults at the collective unvaccinated and those opposing mandatory vaccination is neither accurate nor helpful.

yes, some are outright dingbats and mouth breathing conspiracy theorists, others are just ordinary people who for various reasons have made a choice. A choice I personally disagree with, but I'd prefer to try to understand and support rather than cast vitriol down my nose at them.

Public Health Orders that segregate the unvaccinated , denying them work or social outlets, cannot be some form of punishment for their decision, it can only be justified while there remains sufficient risk to life. Once that risk diminishes enough, which it will very soon, the orders will need to be rescinded.

and yet really thats just a guess. the daily numbers are still very high, infections and deaths,

i cannot believe the mask mandate lifts next week, surely it makes sense to keep it until new years when the holiday shopping rush is over

[David]

[roar]

Yes, in my earlier post I meant "vaccine" not "virus".

[pietillidie]

I find it interesting that, even after being fully vaxxed, we do things like this. What other vaccine have you or anyone taken whereby to ensure it works, you had to wear a mask and avoid people.
Does that really sound like a vaccine that works?

By 'works' do you mean significantly reduces the severity and incidence of disease? Common vaccines like the flu shot or pneumococcal vaccine are similarly imperfect but beneficial. You know this already.