Trade Targets ~ Free Agency & MSD player movements

[Boot]

I don't think there is any doubt now that if McStay is at Collingwood next year, he will be playing as a key defender and not in the forward line, albeit he could be a swingman in case of emergency. I'm comfortable with this strategy as relying on Moore as the lockdown key defender, limits his ability to intercept and attack from the half back line, where he could be a future Brownlow medalist.
Also Jeremy Howe is probably only going to play next season before retirement so we need to find a replacement for him, which we hopefully already have done so with the development of Nathan Murphy this year.
Hence looking ahead the defensive group at Collingwood of Marynard, McStay, Murphy, Quaynor, Moore, Crisp, Ruscoe and Noble has a very settled look to it with reserves such as Dean, Will Kelly and a couple of other younger players looking to develop further over the next 12 months. I'm assuming that Nick Daicos will progress from his role of half back flanker this year to be more on-ball where he will eventually replace the aging Pendlebury.

[lazzadesilva]

Personally, I think Tarantos arrival at Collingwood is dependent upon DeGoey leaving. If DeGoey stays, then securing Taranto becomes a lot more problematic.

Hypothetically and potentially, how realistic is the prospect of both playing at Collingwood next season? Is it possible, probable or pie in the sky stuff?

[MatthewBoydFanClub]

Personally, I think Tarantos arrival at Collingwood is dependent upon DeGoey leaving. If DeGoey stays, then securing Taranto becomes a lot more problematic.

Hypothetically and potentially, how realistic is the prospect of both playing at Collingwood next season? Is it possible, probable or pie in the sky stuff?

Probable or pie in the sky I don't know, but if we can keep De Goey and Grundy and recruit McStay and Taranto, I reckon we'll be vying for a premiership next year.

[MatthewBoydFanClub]

[quote="Mr Miyagi"]In before the “let’s coax Josh Kennedy out of retirement” posts start

[Pies2016]

A poster has suggested Henry may be on the outer, with interest from cats; what could we realistically get for him, and how might it help get a KPD or KPF?

SEN are saying talks with Henry’s management have stalled ( not gone backwards ) over McStays possible arrival at Collingwood. Henry wants to stay but he’s concerned about his short term future should McStay make his way to the club. It might be as simple as Collingwood confirming to him whether he’s coming or not and if so, what position have they earmarked him for.
It’s actually a fair point, even without McStay as part of the conversation. Johnson has grabbed his chance and Krueger and Cameron are likely to spend more time up forward in 2023 ( unless Grundy leaves )
I could easily come up with a decent forward line in 2023 that doesn’t include either McStay or Henry. Who would have thought.

[stui magpie]

I don't think there is any doubt now that if McStay is at Collingwood next year, he will be playing as a key defender and not in the forward line, albeit he could be a swingman in case of emergency. I'm comfortable with this strategy as relying on Moore as the lockdown key defender, limits his ability to intercept and attack from the half back line, where he could be a future Brownlow medalist.
Also Jeremy Howe is probably only going to play next season before retirement so we need to find a replacement for him, which we hopefully already have done so with the development of Nathan Murphy this year.
Hence looking ahead the defensive group at Collingwood of Marynard, McStay, Murphy, Quaynor, Moore, Crisp, Ruscoe and Noble has a very settled look to it with reserves such as Dean, Will Kelly and a couple of other younger players looking to develop further over the next 12 months. I'm assuming that Nick Daicos will progress from his role of half back flanker this year to be more on-ball where he will eventually replace the aging Pendlebury.

Agree with all of that

[RudeBoy]

I'd be more confident that McStay is being considered by us as a defender, to replace Roughead. We don't have another 200 cm (or thereabouts) to play on the big power forwards. Both Dean and Kelly are unknown quantities and neither are big enough for this role. They are more likely being groomed to replace the ageing Howe. Moore is better suited at CHB. Hopefully Kreuger develops into our own power forward.

[the fuzz]

What are peoples thoughts on Bobby Hill?
I heard John Ralph on 'On the Couch' matter of factly say Hill will most likely be at the Pies.
I'd love him at the Club, though I do feel like we have enough small forwards at the moment.

[stui magpie]

^

Don't know much about him, isn't he a quick crumbing small forward?

If he is, we could do with adding that to the mix.

Beau is a fast pressure forward and tackling machine (Think Cyril on roids)
Ginni is a goal sneak (think Medhurst )
Billy is a KPP in a small blokes body

A speedy front and square crumber like Leon would find a spot.

[watt price tully]

A poster has suggested Henry may be on the outer, with interest from cats; what could we realistically get for him, and how might it help get a KPD or KPF?

SEN are saying talks with Henry’s management have stalled ( not gone backwards ) over McStays possible arrival at Collingwood. Henry wants to stay but he’s concerned about his short term future should McStay make his way to the club. It might be as simple as Collingwood confirming to him whether he’s coming or not and if so, what position have they earmarked him for.
It’s actually a fair point, even without McStay as part of the conversation. Johnson has grabbed his chance and Krueger and Cameron are likely to spend more time up forward in 2023 ( unless Grundy leaves )
I could easily come up with a decent forward line in 2023 that doesn’t include either McStay or Henry. Who would have thought.

SEN also saying pies highly interested in Bobby Hill (& visa-versa).

[Pies2016]

I don't think there is any doubt now that if McStay is at Collingwood next year, he will be playing as a key defender and not in the forward line, albeit he could be a swingman in case of emergency. I'm comfortable with this strategy as relying on Moore as the lockdown key defender, limits his ability to intercept and attack from the half back line, where he could be a future Brownlow medalist.
Also Jeremy Howe is probably only going to play next season before retirement so we need to find a replacement for him, which we hopefully already have done so with the development of Nathan Murphy this year.
Hence looking ahead the defensive group at Collingwood of Marynard, McStay, Murphy, Quaynor, Moore, Crisp, Ruscoe and Noble has a very settled look to it with reserves such as Dean, Will Kelly and a couple of other younger players looking to develop further over the next 12 months. I'm assuming that Nick Daicos will progress from his role of half back flanker this year to be more on-ball where he will eventually replace the aging Pendlebury.

Agree with all of that

Agree too and you can also look at this conversely where you picture a forward line without McStay that still looks pretty potent with some quick ball movement -
Elliot / Krueger / ( DeGoey / NDaicos changing )
Ginnivan / Miochek / Johnson and with McCreery, Cameron and Henry all in the mix too. Not a McStay to be seen in that forward line combination but a definite plug n play replacement for Roughead ( at no trade ! )

[Pies2016]

What are peoples thoughts on Bobby Hill?
I heard John Ralph on 'On the Couch' matter of factly say Hill will most likely be at the Pies.
I'd love him at the Club, though I do feel like we have enough small forwards at the moment.

The key to these guys ( McStay, Taranto, Hill ) is to understand you can’t have them all, albeit the more Collingwood players who leave, means the more who can come in.
The aim is to prioritise your needs based on the inclusion who would strengthen your team the most.
For me, a KPD is the biggest focus because we went from having the right balance at the start of season, to being one short on our list after a mid season retirement. This is where we actually have a spot to fill first, not just a spot to strengthen.
Taranto for clearances and our list profile would be perfect but he’s a big outlay, both in contract and trade. Just seems like someone has to move on before he would come in.
Bobby Hill is a distant third need for mine. I’m not sure he necessarily makes us better when you look at the depth we are forming with our front six. The guy who would make our forward line better is Zurhaar and his name keeps coming up as likely moving on at the end of the season. He’s a WA lad but he’s the one who would seriously improve our scoring potency. Another significant trade and not likely to unfold without a decent player having moved on from Collingwood first.
I have no doubt we will land a player or two but the real question remains, just what would we have given up for these new players to have come in.

[Duff Soviet Union]

I think our needs are as follows, in order:

1) A big bodied contested ball winning midfielder. Our midfield is ok, but it's pretty light on in terms of contested ball winners. The Daicoses, Pendles, Sidey, Bianco and, to a lesser extent, Lipinski wouldn't call this their strength. Adams would, but he's been in decline for a couple of years now. Hopefully Carmichael can be this guy, but as good as he's looked at times, that's still hypothetical. The other option here is De Goey, but he can't really be relied on and might not be here next year.
2) A high half forward type who can push up into the midfield and hit targets in inside 50. Too many of our forwards are low possession guys (Ginnivan, Mcreery, Henry). We need someone to link the midfield and the finishers. Again, De Goey is the obvious solution here, but he's never really played this role, he's always been a midfielder or a forward, not a combination.
3) A dashing line breaker either in defence or in the midfield. Again, we don't really have anyone who would call this a strength other than maybe Crisp or Quaynor (who doesn't get that much of the ball).
4) Tall forward. I'm not really as desperate for one of these as most people are. I'm not sure how much of an impact these guys have in the modern game, but we are very light on here.

[swoop42]

The ideal is two tall forwards, two tall backs and two rucks (or one ruck who can cover as a tall forward) and then you build up the mediums and smalls around your spine. We only won a premiership in 2010 after getting Reid and Brown down back, Cloke and Dawes down forward, a pure ruck in Jolly and Leigh Brown as the tough man who could relieve Jolly and play down down in the forward line. Nothing has changed in the last twelve years. The only thing that has changed is the way you move the ball. Mihocek is a lockdown as one of the key forwards. Moore is a lockdown for one of the key backs. Murphy and Johnson can carry out supporting roles in the spine of the field, but realistically to hold down one of those positions you need someone of strength and height who can split packs and Johnson and Murphy can't do that. That why McStay is a natural fit into our best team. Leigh Brown didn't kick a lot of goals and neither does McStay, but what McStay does is fills a vital role within the team structure.

If McStay is coming to the club to play the Leigh Brown role where does that leave Cameron and Grundy next season?

If our intention is to retain both then I would have thought our hope would have been to rotate them between the ruck position and up forward to provide that physical size.

With Mihocek, McStay, Grundy?, Cameron, Elliott, De Goey?, Ginnivan and McCreery among other possible midfielders / flankers rotating through the forward line best of luck to Henry, Johnson and Kreuger in 2023.

To be honest with the display of Cameron this season, his recent re-signing and our desire to sign McStay I'm starting to think our intention really is to trade Grundy and only use Cameron (or Cox) with a McStay or Kreuger as ruck support in 2023 (like 2010).

Of course this could change if McStay is earmarked for defence but no messaging from the club alongside those lines seems to be leaking out in the media as yet and we're all just assuming it to be a real possibility.

[Big T]

The club would be worried about Moore and Murphys durability and Howes age. Seems straight forward to me.

Krueger , who knows if he will play.