Post Match. Swans thump Pies. All comments.

[Haff]

2 comments, no one was attacked for barracking in the game thread or this one. Well done nicks!

And I think the questions asked by the media in the presser were absolutely spot on.

[Larabee]

Let’s take the positives. We aren’t the hunted after these losses. We can become the hunter again. We can go back to basics and do what we do best. Fly is right. Two red hot teams that would probably beat every other team in the comp and we are off the boil.

The only thing we can’t control is a lack of quality talls. Whether that can be fixed in time to qualify, that will be the difference.

Great post mate.

[think positive]

thanks Jezza, much appreciated, and i feel a tad better!
have a good one!

[The Black and White Lion]

The team is clearly not up to it at the moment. I understand what Fly had to say in the presser to those relevant questions. I'm taking those answers with a grain of salt.

The 6 day break thing is rubbish. We've known that was coming for months. Backing up 22players for the first 2 weeks and then saying we might change personnel doesn't reek of a plan to me. We could have injected some youthful exuberance in Round 0 and Round 1 and managed more players if that was a real concern before Week 1.

Fly has a real problem because the players are not prepared as a team on the field at this time. They might be off field. They will be doubting that too at the moment. Fly's giving reassurance so they don't drop there heads but if you were watching Fly and Bolton on the bench (yes Bolton was on the bench for periods last night) Fly was giving some angry messages to Bolton. The pies coaching staff will be genuinely shocked with the first two weeks results but minor changes aren't going to fix 13 or 14players who are well down.

AJ wash awful when he had a chance but he's not a KPF and shouldn't be playing that role in a structure that demands it. He's a medium tall at best, he's lightweight and lacking confidence. Reality is McInnes isn't much different at this age so the likelihood that Reef will solve the forward half woes is pretty low. If we swap AJ out for Reef and the rest of the team structure and form remains we're going to see similar results and the woes continue.

Think we need 3 talls in attack to help each other out. Hill and another at the feet with one lead up small / medium. Not fussed the tall combination it could be any of Mihocek, Cox, AJ, McInnes, Frampton, Begg and Steene. They are our options so we have to use them.

I think Frampton needs to come in and go back though as were getting smashed in marking contests in the back 50.

FWIW I hate this round 0 nonsense at that round 0 doesn't count in Fantasy stats. Imagine saying Round 0 doesn't count to brownlow and ladder points!

[robevpau1]

A pertinent point by Leigh Matthews last night. "Team defence only works when you've got midfield pressure. Collingwood's got no midfield pressure so their team defence is getting cut apart."

So - no midfield control = breakdown of system defence via opposition pressure = inability to set-up systemically creative forward play.

We need to persist with the experience of Mitchell to nullify opposition centre-bounce clearances and with Fin Macrae's developing creative clearance work.

This can be turned around with the right personal.

Forward set-up also requires a reset and new personnel.

[stui magpie]

I thought we had a fair crack, not about hunger at all. The story of the game is how Sydney systematically disconnected each part of our structure, rendering our effort in vain. Our links were cut and so players functioned in isolation from each other for long periods of the game. Mids couldn't connect to the forwards, half backs struggled to connect sidewards with our mids. There were no waves, they were blocked and dismantled. Twice in two weeks. So it's up to the coaches to figure out how to get the connections happening again because all the gps records in the world won't matter if they don't chain together like they did in 22 and 23. It was like we were 2023 Sydney and they were 2023 Collingwood tonight.

Absolutely. They scored something like 12 of their goals from turnovers. Our backs struggled to clear defence and when we turned it over they sliced us open over the back.

Effort was there, intensity was improved, connection poor and we need a marking target up forward.

Everything is fixable. Lets see where we sit when we have the Bye in round 5 after St Kilda, Brisbane and Hawthorn.

[Culprit]

Two teams have done their homework and have dismantled our game plan.

[The Black and White Lion]

Sounds like McInnes hardly touched it in the VFL practice match against the Borough. Not sure if he gets a game either. Frampton kicked one. Carmichael a few, Sullivan one. No mention of Bytel.

Again Macrae can't argue about the 6day break when our VFL team played an hour before the seniors.

Sounds like Allan, Noble and Jiath played well and no new injuries were reported in the VFL or the AFL matches so apart from the long term injuries, we have a good list to pick from. Sofrinidis called out at FB but he aint on the list. Slim pickings for the problems we've got.

Injuries could have forced our hand but the coaches have to make some hard decisions now. Will it be some brutal Sunday training or a light week on the track.

At the end of the day our system is a shambles at the moment and that's one of Fly's key mantras. If the personnel aren't going to change dramatically then the focus needs to be on the coaching to rectify the system.

[joemamone@gmail.com]

Clearly, McInnes must come in. I know my next suggestion is likely to be howled down, but I would play Begg at CHF. Why? I have been watching his progress and what impresses me most is his competitiveness. His second and third efforts are terrific - he fights to keep the ball - this is the sort of approach that assists the smalls. Furthermore, he has a great leap and whilst he is still improving his marking he brings the ball to ground and does not let it go readily.

[Mr Miyagi]

Flag hangover + heavy/short preseason training load + opposition hungrier to beat us. I tipped us being 0-2 and here we are. It’s a long season, anything can happen.

In:Frampton, McInnes, McCrae.
Out: Johnson, ?, ?

[23 YIPPEE!!!]

For stkilda game.

In: Frampton McRae Allan Carmicheal
Out Johnson Side WHE

We need now to blood some kids.


Time has arrived for that long awaited transition.

Time for some youth.

[Mr Miyagi]

Nah Sidey stays in, he was one of our best last night.

[Pies4shaw]

It’s mid-March and the reigning premiers have already been made to play two games - with a third to follow within 12 days of the opener. This is about what you’d expect to see - other teams with far more advanced preparation taking Collingwood down. There has been very little to like, so far. It will be very difficult from here but I do think many of you are just being too harsh blaming the players’ attitude. They look like they’re still working through their preseason to me. There’s little value in coming out like a rocket in March if you can’t sustain it.

[Dark Beanie]

Clearly, McInnes must come in. I know my next suggestion is likely to be howled down, but I would play Begg at CHF. Why? I have been watching his progress and what impresses me most is his competitiveness. His second and third efforts are terrific - he fights to keep the ball - this is the sort of approach that assists the smalls. Furthermore, he has a great leap and whilst he is still improving his marking he brings the ball to ground and does not let it go readily.

Aiden fades in games.
Watched the 1st hal of the VFL and he started like a bomb in the 1st 15 minutes of the 2nd quarter at the centre bounce and attacked around ground. Let one of the Port Melb players get into his head a bit - ended up in a wrestle in the forward pocket.

Reef tried hard but delivery into the forward line was problematic and he is not really made for pack marking, better on the lead. What he does have over AJ is defensive effort.

[Pies2016]

It’s mid-March and the reigning premiers have already been made to play two games - with a third to follow within 12 days of the opener. This is about what you’d expect to see - other teams with far more advanced preparation taking Collingwood down. There has been very little to like, so far. It will be very difficult from here but I do think many of you are just being too harsh blaming the players’ attitude. They look like they’re still working through their preseason to me. There’s little value in coming out like a rocket in March if you can’t sustain it.

I generally agree with you but I do have a few concerns that I don’t necessarily see being rectified by the time we get to mid April.
My concerns centre around our age profile and the ability of so many key players backing up again at 30 plus. There aren’t many players in the history of the game who go on to play career best footy post 30. We need a core group of players to be better again this year if we’re going to defend this flag. Based on what I’ve seen so far, I just don’t see that happening.
Firstly, it’s unreasonable to ask players like Pendles, Sidey, Howe, Elliot, Crisp, Miochek, Mitchell W H E and Cox to be better again. It would be an achievement for any of these players to match their 2023 form. Secondly, if you were to cast an eye over the first two rounds and say who looks to have improved on last season ( small sample size I know ) you would say Cameron and probably Maynard ( with apologies to the likes of Nick who can’t do much more and Pendles and Sidey who continue to defy their age ) So I ask, where does enough improvement come from to make us better again, because right now, we have a long way to go just to break even with last seasons collective output.
The talk of dropping players and replacing them with alternative like for likes, some of whom have also achieved nothing at AFL level, is now a likely outcome but there are no guarantees. There’s a reason why these alternatives weren’t selected in the first place, so giving them a chance because other preferred options failed, wont likely provide the improvement we’re looking for ( not in the short term at least ) Im not saying I don’t support it but genuine improvement will still need to come from our core group of players and that’s the biggest challenge we will face in 2024.