#25 Josh Fraser

Daks · Post by **Daks** » Mon Sep 13, 2004 11:54 am

Yeah, i know. He rarely puts on a show like he did that day, but that will all come with time. At least he's shown that he is capable of big performances like that. If he doesn't turn it on consistantly next year, he never will.

swoop · Post by **swoop** » Mon Sep 13, 2004 12:18 pm

we will be saying the same thing next year if/when he dose not set the world on fire. I still believe he is our second best player behind Buckley, his performance in last years grand final is testimony to that.

Johnson#26 · Post by **Johnson#26** » Mon Sep 13, 2004 4:19 pm

Joel wrote:The problem is, Josh wants to play in the ruck, and doesn't really like ti down forward. I reckon if we keep him down forward, he might do a Paul Salmon.

I agree Joel. If he could act as Salmon and Richards our ruckman we will be very well placed. Don't forget we have C2, C3, Hall and Crow as well as McKee to back our rucks up. We certainly have a bright rucking future -not long after we had the worst in the comp!

He is a big game player. He fires in the finals.

rand corp · Post by **rand corp** » Mon Sep 13, 2004 4:56 pm

Think Josh was more than handy, he was good. Had a good year and did it alone after Guy, Rocca, Cam et al went down.

He is a very good player, that said, he is not a champion, nor a match winner at this stage of his career.

Doubt he will ever be one that can turn a match of his own volition until he learns how to take more contested marks. Doubt he will ever win many hit outs.

In summary, I think he doesn't win enough hitouts to be considered a top ruckman and he doesn't take enough contested marks to be a key forward so, where he ends up in the future (and when we have somewhere near a full squad playing) is questionable.

Doubt he is the best ruck-rover, wing or HFF option on our list. Think he would be too easily out muscled down back.

Permanent leading Forward pocket and relieving ruckman perhaps?

Time will tell. If he could just learn to take more pack marks or marks under pressure all could be turned around but, it is a glaring weakness in his game that sees him often spill overhead marks even with minimul pressure from a much shorter opponent.

Johnson#26 · Post by **Johnson#26** » Mon Sep 13, 2004 5:05 pm

Don't forget his early hamstring injuries which set him back.

Joel · Post by **Joel** » Mon Sep 13, 2004 5:30 pm

By doing a Salmon, I mean leaving Collingwood because he doesn't want to play down forward. Salmon left Essendon initially because he wanted to play in the ruck, and Sheedy wouldn't allow him to. I'm afraid that if we told Josh that he isn't allowed in the ruck, that he might say, 'well I will go somewhere else that will let me play there'.

MarkT · Post by **MarkT** » Mon Sep 13, 2004 5:36 pm

Sheedy didn't mind losing Salmomn at all. It was a good deal for Essendon and they had alternatives at the time. Sheedy had been on Salmon's case for years about not being hard enough when players dropped back and took his run.

magpie meg · Post by **magpie meg** » Tue Sep 14, 2004 1:53 pm

I think that you guys are being way to harsh on Josh, you have to remember that he is still only young and that big men take time to develop, once he shoulderedd the entire rucking duites he blossomed, with guy coming along (who is our #1 ruckman) he can play were he plays best, in the forward line.

Josh always puts a 110% in and always plays well in big games (both grandfinals!!!!) When he beat spider everitt this year you have to remember that spider was the best ruckman going around and he beat him hands down, with his ability to find the ball around the ground.

Just leave him alone and if he hasnt improved by the time he is 25 then you can start this post again!!!!!

Sultan of spin · Post by **Sultan of spin** » Tue Sep 14, 2004 3:40 pm

Josh had a wonderful season in 2003 and has probably the no 2 ruck in the league behind Goodes. This season hasn't been as good but he was still servicable. Next year with a good pre-season and a good run with injuries he will be a star

Mr Burns 17 · Post by **Mr Burns 17** » Tue Sep 14, 2004 4:34 pm

Any of you so called Pie fans who bag Josh Fraser can go support Richmond. Do you really watch any football and see how good this bloke is? He is only 22 and will be a future captain of collingwood. I think if Guy Richards can be half the player Fraser is now, then we will be in for some good years. How many big ruckman playing now are good at ground level with second and third efforts like Fraser? Answer. Not many.

Post by **BBHS** » Tue Sep 14, 2004 4:35 pm

Could'nt agree with Mr Burns more.

Sultan of spin · Post by **Sultan of spin** » Tue Sep 14, 2004 4:37 pm

Mr Burns 17 wrote: How many big ruckman playing now are good at ground level with second and third efforts like Fraser? Answer. Not many.

Answer = None

Joel · Post by **Joel** » Tue Sep 14, 2004 4:56 pm

Sultan of spin wrote:Josh had a wonderful season in 2003 and has probably the no 2 ruck in the league behind Goodes. This season hasn't been as good but he was still servicable. Next year with a good pre-season and a good run with injuries he will be a star

As if he was second best ruckman in the league. You conveniently forget the likes of Everitt, Brisbane's ruckmen, Gardiner at West Coast, Stafford was outplaying everyone for half of the year, the list could go on.

IMO, serviceable is no longer good enough, it just ain't good enough for Collingwood. We need players that are going to perform week in, and week out. Josh is capable of doing that, and has shown plenty in the past. But, the consistency isn't there.

Johnson#26 · Post by **Johnson#26** » Tue Sep 14, 2004 4:57 pm

Correct Mr Burns. He is one of the new breed of ruckmen.

Joel · Post by **Joel** » Tue Sep 14, 2004 5:00 pm

Mr Burns 17 wrote:Any of you so called Pie fans who bag Josh Fraser can go support Richmond. Do you really watch any football and see how good this bloke is? He is only 22 and will be a future captain of collingwood. I think if Guy Richards can be half the player Fraser is now, then we will be in for some good years. How many big ruckman playing now are good at ground level with second and third efforts like Fraser? Answer. Not many.

No one is denying the bloke has heart. No one would ever deny that, so stick to the point, and the BS about bagging Josh Fraser is crap. That is just a substandard response from supporters who live on their laurels, and don't want the club to progress. A player must continue to improve, that is fact, otherwise we just go backwards. I don't think anyone has bagged him, no one is denying his talent, I just want to start seeing it on a CONSISTENT basis starting from next year.

His second and third efforts are sensational, and he displays a never say die attitude. No one is denying that. Let me repeat, no one is denying that.

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#25 Josh Fraser