Post Match. Giants down Pies - All comments please

[ANNODAM]

And that last Sydney goal against north has sent us to second last on the ladder.

Yep & that's where we deserve to be!

Yet last year & the year before that & the year before that & the year before that, we blamed injuries for our woes, what's this years excuse now?
FMD this is all tiresome & boring.
This is as good as it gets folks, this is Figgie's team, this is Figgie's doing, all of it!

If it was any other Coach, he would've been gone long ago, get rid of this muppet in charge once & for all, the best & richest Club in the land has become a joke, a fkn laughing stock!



I am embarrassed at what we have become!

[PyreneesPie]

. In the end, I think the following must be taken into consideration: 1. Inexperience of both the players and their interaction with each other due to best team available and changes probably cost us, not anything else. 2. Shayde and Reid both need to bulk up - too easily wrestled/pushed out of a contest. 3. Maynard needs to play up the ground - wasted in back pocket/flank. Bring in Sharenberg to replace him back there. 4. Drop Fasolo - even during the warm up he was more intent on practicing fancy snaps than consolidating his ability to kick a set shot at an unfamiliar ground. 5. Stick with the current team and set up with only minor tweaks - they have to get used to playing together. 6. Bring Treloar back in at Blairs expense - not because Blair was that bad - but there isn't room for him with the rest playing. 7. When Varcoe is fit, drop least performing player of his size/type - this could even be WHE as he is, at time, ordinary. 8. Stop conjecture of Buckleys coaching tenure - if he can turn this team around and they start winning lots of games due to time spent and experience gained with each other - then it could be justified to give him another year extension. 9. Take a long hard look at how we are developing/using our up and comers in the 2's - I went to a VFL match at Essendon a few weeks ago and it seemed everyone was being thrown all around the ground position wise - if you have recruited a player to be a future key forward, back or whatever, you must play them there week in week out and only move them somewhere else if you want them to get an appreciation of how an opposition player plays their position - for example, play a CHB at CHF on a gun opposition CHB to learn from that player. and 10. Appreciate the speed of the game, the very young players we have in the side, give some credit to oppositions who have quite often, taken a 10 or 20 year journey to get to being a top 4 club again, I know it's not palatable to be languishing, but the 2017 competition has already shown it is not predicatable.

I reckon you make some really good points ROB. I've been thinking for quite a while that it would be interesting to give Maynard a go further down the ground. He can certainly kick some ball-bursting goals!!

I fully agree too that the VFL can be a very effective training ground for future key positions players, if used correctly. I can remember a big bodied full forward learning his trade in the "seconds" years ago, when the reserves would play before the main game. His name was Saverio Rocca.

[think positive]

I saw nothing in last nights narrow loss that I would blame on poor coaching. If Dunn kicks out to the short alone option instead of to a contest we have a spirited win which could have kick started our season (again). Instead we will have another week of rehashed media crap about our coach.

In the match day thread at 3 quarter time I was imploring the coach to move Reid down back and move Goldsack to the forward line. I also wanted Grundy to ruck all of the last quarter. So what transpired in the last quarter? Goldsack was brilliant in the backline in the last quarter. Reid played his best quarter in the forward line and it started to click with Moore in the ruck in the last quarter. All this proves is the coach knows the capabilities of his players better than you or I. The mistakes people are stating are the cause of the loss are the result of individual errors on the field. That's not the coaching that's at fault. That's human errors. The other side makes human errors as well. GWS made slightly fewer errors than us and that's why they won.
I'm happy for people to make a case that Buckley can't coach based on 5 1/2 years of failure on the field. But stating that he doesn't have a game plan, doesn't have the players wanting to play for him and is a poor match day coach, is a total misrepresentation of the truth as far as I'm able to observe as a spectator.

You just don't want to change your Nick's username.

[eddiesmith]

would love to see Pick #2 + Moore on the trade table at season's end.
Good chance we could land either Schacke / Reid / Martin / Fyfe with that package.

Moore is useless. He could kick 10 goals a game for the next 100 games and I wont forgive him for costing us the game tonight.

That is the Stupidest Post I seen on here for Years.

We might as well Trade Grundy as well then

We will be trading him when he says he wants to go home at the end of the year...

[Rush Stand Wing]

Yep, never the coaches problem. Yet these systematic failures to finish teams off didn't happen every freaking week under the former coach.

Take the kick in from 1:10 on the clock for a start. If you want to be critical of the situation, which I always will be while Bucks is coach, the aim should have been to roost it down the boundary and punch it out 70m out. Now the execution of the kick went a little to far from the boundary for my liking. And then you have a roving Moore attempting to run and carry up the wing cause there was nothing to kick to up the ground. He hand passes to our ruckman we cough it up and Blair desperately slides into wards legs to kill the ball.

Under no circumstances would that have been acceptable under the former coach. Had Moore gone the handpass instead of roosting it down the line MM would have given him an almighty spray.

My point is, under pressure when your knackered you revert to things you have been drilled into you over the summer. And that my friends is the key problem. We resort to run and carry shit when the game is on the line because that's what the coach drills into players.

And that handpass to Grundy never happens under the old coach cause the old coach drilled kick first and hug the boundary every preseason. The ball had to be killed and taken out. It wasn't and we lost.

It's been ground hog day for 6 seasons now

We're not mentioning the stricter Deliberate OOB rules ??? Oh No because that would deflate our whole argument now wouldn't it !? Hugging the boundary in that situation can no longer be entrenched in the subconscious thinking because it can turn the ball over. Although the interpretation was more relaxed this week so maybe Moore could have picked up on that and made this decision himself. Fair dinkum, is he responsible for wiping their asses as well ??

I beg to differ. Like I said Moore had two options. He could have kicked down the line to a contest or just out. Even if GWS did get a free or a mark, they are on their own defensive 50 with 50 seconds in the game to go. Collingwood has time to flood back into gws forward 50 and stop that quick entry that they got from the ward free kick on centre wing.

And no he is not responsible for wiping their asses. But he is responsible for drilling a gameplan that can not only put us into a position to win, but to close out game when under pressure and in the dying minutes. And rarely in 6 seasons have we been able to close out games well

I think you'll find there were no players up field as everyone had already flooded GWS F50 during the kick-in. If he were to kick up the line to space and the ball goes oob - then free kick. If he tries a fumble oob - free kick. He would have had blokes screaming 'one minute left ' at this point (50sec)so he had to carry for a bit longer. He simply didn't hit the handball target - SKILL EXECUTION

The game plan that was brought into the game did, in fact put us in a position to win. We didn't close it because they are a good team and we are yards behind in talent. They should win the flag this year.

Mate, if you were ever going to point the finger at the coach for a close loss, it would not be this one. It was just a heart breaker.

I thought Moore had one his best for the club last night. He shone brightly. Its obvious that much like his old man, he thrives around the ball so that's one silver lining from the game. Moore proved he is not supposed to be caged in the F50 any longer.

[Cruisinwithdids]

I'm a bit intrigued by the concentration on one players one action in one game changing anything of meaning at this club. 6 years of systematic decline, under Buckley have rendered Collingwood as barely relevant in the completion. It seems that McGuire being the media magnate he is, has the footballing world's media scared to say a word against Buckley as the club just continues to sink to new lows. He has been given amazing slack - even Richmond has made 2 finals series since our last one. It's just about ego now - two very big ones, that are apparently more important than the club. Poor coaching cost close games, poor coaches fail to galvanise teams to show individual flair and daring, poor coaches keep distance from their players, poor coaches often get their opportunity where there was no selection process. Buckley is a poor coach.

[Cam]

Geelong 2006 had an issue of extracurricular nature, same one in fact, as Geelong 2010 coincidently.

[dalyc]

Geelong 2006 had an issue of extracurricular nature, same one in fact, as Geelong 2010 coincidently.

Please explain?

[dalyc]

would love to see Pick #2 + Moore on the trade table at season's end.
Good chance we could land either Schacke / Reid / Martin / Fyfe with that package.

Moore is useless. He could kick 10 goals a game for the next 100 games and I wont forgive him for costing us the game tonight.

That is the Stupidest Post I seen on here for Years.

We might as well Trade Grundy as well then

We will be trading him when he says he wants to go home at the end of the year...

Lies

[Damien]

It seems that McGuire being the media magnate he is, has the footballing world's media scared to say a word against Buckley.

OK now I've seen it all on Nicks.

[Krakouer Magic]

We're not mentioning the stricter Deliberate OOB rules ??? Oh No because that would deflate our whole argument now wouldn't it !? Hugging the boundary in that situation can no longer be entrenched in the subconscious thinking because it can turn the ball over. Although the interpretation was more relaxed this week so maybe Moore could have picked up on that and made this decision himself. Fair dinkum, is he responsible for wiping their asses as well ??

I beg to differ. Like I said Moore had two options. He could have kicked down the line to a contest or just out. Even if GWS did get a free or a mark, they are on their own defensive 50 with 50 seconds in the game to go. Collingwood has time to flood back into gws forward 50 and stop that quick entry that they got from the ward free kick on centre wing.

And no he is not responsible for wiping their asses. But he is responsible for drilling a gameplan that can not only put us into a position to win, but to close out game when under pressure and in the dying minutes. And rarely in 6 seasons have we been able to close out games well

I think you'll find there were no players up field as everyone had already flooded GWS F50 during the kick-in. If he were to kick up the line to space and the ball goes oob - then free kick. If he tries a fumble oob - free kick. He would have had blokes screaming 'one minute left ' at this point (50sec)so he had to carry for a bit longer. He simply didn't hit the handball target - SKILL EXECUTION

The game plan that was brought into the game did, in fact put us in a position to win. We didn't close it because they are a good team and we are yards behind in talent. They should win the flag this year.

Mate, if you were ever going to point the finger at the coach for a close loss, it would not be this one. It was just a heart breaker.

I thought Moore had one his best for the club last night. He shone brightly. Its obvious that much like his old man, he thrives around the ball so that's one silver lining from the game. Moore proved he is not supposed to be caged in the F50 any longer.

You see it as just simply skill execution. I see it as players I'll equiped to deal with high pressure situations. And that comes back to coaching and on field leadership.

Have a look at the gws v dogs game from a few weeks back. 1:30 on the clock when Shaw has to kick out. Just look at the intent of gws in that situation. They do everything they can to cause stoppages and get the ball out. Ward and Kennedy just boot the shit out of it and it ends up out on the fwd flank. Yes the ump calls it deliberate and dogs get a last chance to rebound. But it gives the gws respite to get back in defence and means the Dogs are at least 2 kicks from the teeth of goal. Had there not been a skill error by Mumford (he drops the dogs in bound kick, a sitter mark on centre wing) then the game is over as gws milk the clock and pump it to the boundary in their own fwd 50.

The clear intent of gws was to get the ball as far from Dogs goal as possible. Intent in pressure situations is coached and on field leadership. Compare it to how we handled the last 2 mins and it's chalk and cheese. It ain't just talent. It's drilling young players what to do. And gws were hardly that talented last night.

And go have a look at the last 2 mins vs the swans. Again how many opportunities do you want to roost it long down the line? Instead we run and carry out of defence. We gave so many chances to swans when we should have been playing for territory and playing for territory. It's a team mentality.

My arguement is basically with a better coach we handle tight contests like that much better. There is just no point risking turning the ball over on centre wing like we did. It's happened for 6 seasons now. This isn't just bad luck. It keeps happening time and again.

We played it more like we had to win the game when all we had to do was defend the lead. It's a fundamental ideological flaw that will come back to bite us time and again if Bucks remains coach

[mooretreloar]

^Everything's Buckley's fault isn't it. You probably blame him if we lose the coin toss at the start of the game.

Change the channel, Krakouer.

Could it be as simple as that Moore is a 30 game player that may have been in such a position only once or twice in his career and panicked. If he was a 130 game player, he is more likely to have made a different decision. I suppose not because this goes against your mission of ensuring Buckley is sacked.

[melliot]

FWIW I agree with KM. What he is explaining is only one example of failure of teaming/structure/team setup that fails too often.

We rarely win the tight one because of these fundamental issues.

I have plenty of examples of the team consistently not doing the simple things right. Or setting up right to how they want to play. For me when watching live, it is inexplicable frustration watching them play.

It is mostly a coaching problem IMO.

[mooretreloar]

^
He may be right, he may be wrong.

What I do know is right is that KM and a lot of his mates blame Buckley for everything under the sun. What I also know is right is that Buckley is not on the ground during play. What I also know is right is that too much blame is apportioned to a coach when things aren't going well and too much credit is given to a coach when things are going well.

What I also know is right that the old coach he keeps rabbiting on about is a self centred and egotistical man, who thinks everything is about him. If I was in charge of the club, I would have sacked him after his Footy Show interview in late 2011.

What I also know is right is that the old coach won 3 flags in 30 odd years, two of them with the WA state side. What I also know is right is the old coach was one of the worst game day and tactical coaches in the history of the game.

However, I agree with you it is extremely frustrating watching us play at the minute, it is pull your hair out stuff.

[Jezza]

Biggest losing margin so far:

Western Bulldogs - 16
Collingwood - 23
Geelong - 29
Melbourne - 29
Port Adelaide - 31
St Kilda - 38
Sydney - 42
North Melbourne - 43
West Coast - 50
GWS - 56
Adelaide - 59
Essendon - 65
Richmond - 76
Brisbane - 83
Hawthorn - 86
Fremantle - 89
Carlton - 90
Gold Coast - 102

It obviously doesn't tell the full story about the game plan and our W-L record, but I found this stat interesting nevertheless.