Coronavirus 4 - Kingdom of the Crystal Skull

[Dave The Man]

Another Story why it's Important to get Vaccinated and Why you don't Listen to Idiots on Social Media:

https://www.theage.com.au/national/in-t ... 596gc.html

[eddiesmith]

While I don't support their cause, I do agree that the new legislation should not be allowed in it's current form and I have sympathy for them.

Andrews' new bill needs to be opposed strenuously.

Other states like NSW already have this Law

Except in NSW any restrictions are reviewed by a committee that is made up from all parties in the parliament, under Andrews proposed legislation he'd appoint a committee to 'review' the rules but they'd have no power to actually change anything.

[Pies4shaw]

^ What's the role of the Subordinate Legislation Act in this?

[eddiesmith]

None I imagine as under that legislation they couldn't impose any of the Covid restrictions!

The new legislation is even written to ensure the Scrutiny of Acts committee in Parliament is powerless to stop anything as the Minister can overrule them.

[Pies4shaw]

It's really important in statutory interpretation to "imagine" what might be in applicable legislation.

Anyway, I am sufficiently bored to have had a look to answer my own question. Proposed section 165CR of the new Bill will have the effect that the Subordinate Legislation Act won't apply to "pandemic declarations" - but for that proposed section, such declarations would plainly be "subordinate instruments" subject to Parts 3A and 5A of that Act (which is the regular means by which subordinate instruments are brought before the Parliament and may be disallowed). However, the referral, tabling and scrutiny provisions in the new Bill are based on those in the Subordinate Legislation Act, so I suppose someone could have a look at the differences in practical operation between the general regime and the specific one that applies here and work out whether the different mechanisms are appropriate or not.

[think positive]

^

You'd lose that bet. Most of them are just normal people who, for a bunch of different reasons, don't want to get the vaccine.

I don't agree with protest marches in general, I think they're counter productive and attract the lunatic fringe. No doubt there was a number of those in the mob but there's a lot of intelligent, educated individuals who for different reasons have a real problem with the vaccine and being segregated for declining to take it.

While I don't support their cause, I do agree that the new legislation should not be allowed in it's current form and I have sympathy for them.

Want. Interesting word.

Don’t want the vaccine, but do they want to work? Or get the dole if not?

People want, communities need.

Unless they have a genuine certified reason, tell em to grow up. I also reckon Dave has a point. I know a fair few anti Vaxers, a couple are vegan drive you crazy activists, the rest have definately put way worse in Their bodies!

My eldest had her second Pfizer last monday, Thursday she had a weird headache watching tv with me, I checked her temperature with the gun thing, gave her some Panadol and put her to bed. Didn’t sleep, checked the poor kid all night long! She’s fine, but I’d like to thank the damn hysteria mob for my total lack of sleep! Junior gets her second moderna next week!

[stui magpie]

People ave different beliefs, sometimes they can get very passionate about things that most of us don't. In a black sort of way, that Age article that Dave linked to about the people who didn't believe in Covid finding themselves in ICU reminds me of the Rowan Atkinson skit "Welcome to Hell" when he says to the atheists, aren't you surprised to be here.

Anyway, bugger the case numbers and the hospitalisation stats from Vic are useless, so lets look at some good numbers.

Both Victoria and NSW active case numbers are steadily declining. Vic is down to 16,000 from 19,400 in the past 7 days, NSW down to 2910 from 3342. More people are recovering each day than are getting infected.

Numbers in ICU are also declining. 91 in Vic, down from 127 and 48 in NSW down from 72.

We're also very close to hitting 90% of >12 year old fully vaccinated. Victoria will hit this milestone in 15 days, NSW in 3 days, both well ahead of the national numbers.

Stuff is working.

[think positive]

yep 90% of people elligible, and most of us havent turned into the walking dead, so yeah, once again to that "special" 10%, roll your sleeves up you selfish stupid pricks! its not about you!

[Pies4shaw]

People ave different beliefs, sometimes they can get very passionate about things that most of us don't.

Some people get very passionate about not lodging tax returns. We put them in prison.

[stui magpie]

Yes, but it's not illegal to not get vaccinated.

[David]

For those worried about (or otherwise interested in) the Victorian pandemic bill, this is a helpful overview from civil-liberties group Liberty Victoria about what's good and bad in it:

https://libertyvictoria.org.au/content/ ... egislation

Liberty Victoria welcomes the introduction of pandemic specific legislation with much improved accountability and transparency provisions, which do not exist for the current state of emergency powers.

The state of emergency powers were not framed with ongoing pandemics in mind, and the purpose of those powers was designed for short-term crises. This means that the emergency powers have been a blunt instrument and not fit-for-purpose in respect of more long-term dangers to public health. There is therefore a need for pandemic specific legislation.

The Bill provides greater regulation of the powers to make a pandemic declaration, and permits Parliament to disallow an order if the Scrutiny of Acts and Regulations Committee makes a report with such a recommendation. The Bill also includes greater transparency measures than those that exist in the Public Health and Wellbeing Act (PHWA) currently, by requiring the publication of public health advice and human rights considerations in respect of pandemic orders. This is to be commended. However, these principles should not just apply to pandemics, but to the exercise of the state of emergency powers under the PHWA in general. The Bill could be improved by those principles expressly applying to the PHWA as a whole, not just to the pandemic-specific part of the Bill.

Liberty Victoria welcomes the inclusion of principles in the Bill that expressly require that decisions are made and informed by public health advice, transparency and accountability is promoted, contact tracing information is protected, and that any limitations on the human rights protected by the Charter should be demonstrably justified in accordance with s 7(2) of the Charter. These kinds of clear principles are not made express in the current PHWA.

Liberty Victoria also supports the introduction of clear privacy protections of information gathered for public health reasons. This is something that Liberty Victoria has advocated for on a number of occasions and the Bill is a significant improvement on the current state of affairs.

The introduction and role of the Independent Pandemic Advisory Committee is also to be commended. In order for the committee to carry out its functions properly, the committee must be given adequate funding and resources, otherwise its purpose and role will likely be diminished.

Liberty Victoria also supports the introduction of a concessional infringement scheme for eligible persons. However, it appears this scheme will not operate retrospectively, so those who have already been fined under CHO directions since March 2020 will not get the benefit of the scheme. To improve this, the Bill should include an express provision that the concessional infringement scheme applies to infringements that have been issued since March 2020. Further, there should be additional funding for community legal centres and Victoria Legal Aid so that they can assist eligible persons to access the concessional infringement scheme.

The Bill is not perfect and Liberty Victoria has concerns about aspects of the proposed new legislation.

For example, Liberty Victoria opposes the introduction of an aggravated offence which carries imprisonment as a penalty. Even though proceedings for that offence cannot be commenced without approval of the Secretary or the Chief Commissioner of Police, Liberty Victoria is concerned that this offence will apply disproportionately to vulnerable people, as has happened with infringements handed out in breach of CHO directions over the last 18 months.

Liberty Victoria’s comment also recommends a number of improvements that should be implemented, such as:

• The role of SARC and its ability to recommend disallowance of a pandemic order should be improved, so that disallowance of a pandemic order can occur when only one House of Parliament votes for it;
• There should be an affordable and effective merits review available to people affected by a pandemic order, particularly for orders that involve detention;
• There should be permanent protections for renters whose ability to pay rent is affected by restrictions imposed for public health purposes;
• There should be an express statement in the Bill that instruments such as pandemic declarations and pandemic orders have to be interpreted in accordance with the Charter.

A longer submission is available here:

https://libertyvictoria.org.au/sites/de ... ande_0.pdf

[roar]

yep 90% of people elligible, and most of us havent turned into the walking dead, so yeah, once again to that "special" 10%, roll your sleeves up you selfish stupid pricks! its not about you!

But some people have died from the vaccine so they aren't totally without reasons. Should they have to run that risk?

[Pies4shaw]

Yes, but it's not illegal to not get vaccinated.

My point is that it should be. Think of all the things we are required, from time to time, to do upon pain of criminal penalty.

[stui magpie]

Yes, but when I was talking about people getting passionate I was thinking more of vegans and god botherers.

[think positive]

yep 90% of people elligible, and most of us havent turned into the walking dead, so yeah, once again to that "special" 10%, roll your sleeves up you selfish stupid pricks! its not about you!

But some people have died from the vaccine so they aren't totally without reasons. Should they have to run that risk?

a lot more hAVE DIED from covid!

if they dont want to run the risk thats fine, they can stay the **** home and not infect anyone else, oh and they can live off their savings, no welfare

9o% have recieved it, what makes them so special?