How is Balme feeling today? AND Chocko you are a GOOSE!!!

[Lone Ranger]

Labrooy, you cant force players to go to another club. If they dont agree to the trade, the trade doesnt go ahead...end if story.
The only time they are compelled to go is if they are taken in the draft.

[labrooy]

LR37,

That is my point. They don't push and they do their best to accomodate players who want to go. There is no doubt that Sydney and Carlton got the best of the Davis and Scotland trades. Collingwood could have refused their offers and the players in question would have had to stay or go in the pre-season draft.

By doing these things the players are much happier.

[Fatui Ataata]

Interesting to note a comment about Brisbane not trading because they didn't need to. I would compare Brisbane's effort this year to Hawthorn in 1991 and in comparing our lists - I would dare say, at the risk of copping Greg's wraith, that the Lions have the means and the need to rejuvenate their ageing list more than we do.

Don't throw the baby out with the bathwater - there are many reasons we stuffed up the opportunity this year that have been dissected ad nauseum. It was inexplicable and it hurts, particularly with our history of losing GF's. ALL clubs make poor choices and miss out on players. Our recent record and revival show we're doing better than all but one team, which has had generous outside assistance not afforded to us.

I would have loved N Brown, N Stevens or J Rawlings to strengthen our list, but at what cost? PA have it in for us and wanted to punish Stevens for leaving and thwart our attempts to widen the gap between the two sides. Let's move on - I'm sure the players will keep at it, positive in the knowledge that they CAN be the best. And they can only do their best Greg, as we can as supporters to SUPPORT them and the Club.

Even the Beatles had some ordinary songs mate.

[piedys]

Even the Beatles had some ordinary songs mate.

FA, No. No, No, No, No, No. You are wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong.
Oh wait on.... Octapus' Garden. But that's it. Other than that you are wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong.

Dyso

[Fatui Ataata]

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[Fatui Ataata]

Greg, no one doubts your devotion to the Club however you keep dragging up the past to justify your current dissatisfaction with the way the Club is currently operating. We are all frustrated - I wasn't even alive for '64, '66 or '70 and they pain me greatly still.

You also seem to have a knack of twisting history in a negative way (eg 1936) to add weight to your arguments. Sure, 1970, 1977 & 2003 have been terrible losses in their own ways, however shitty luck has done us over a few times as well ('64, '66, '70, '79, '02), not to mention GF's we've lost when it was a monumental effort to be there in the first place. Unfortunately those outside the club, those without greater understanding and the record books are uncompromising and condemning.

In the days of open slather we passed on Quinlan, Conlen, Ashman et al & picked up broken down couldabeens instead. How about letting Bob Rose go back in the 50's when he was still in his prime because we refused to acknowledge the best player in the comp couldn't afford to support his family on the measley standard fee we paid him. Those decisions alone cost us too many premierships I shudder to think.

I guess you need to discern the losses caused mainly by things that happened on the day and losses in which poor recruiting and poor administration played a major part. 2003 was the former, not the latter.

We work within the framework of a very different competition to the old VFL - its not as easy as it used to be and there are risks taken, some work, some don't. From the brink we've worked our arse off to get back to a position of power, on and off the field. There are a number of clubs that would love to be consistantly challenging as we have, bar the 90's. The way the club operates now is the envy of most other clubs. We continue to move forward and should give it a good crack next year as well.

Noel Judkins has been a major factor in turning around the worst list in the comp to one of the best in a short period of time. His record at Essendon was just as good. As already mentioned by other posters, it is also a team decision - Malthouse, Balme, Judkins & Kleiman would all have a fair input. Judkins would be told what types of players to identify and be responsible for finding the best player to meet that criteria.

Sorry about the Beatles crack Greg - they are legendary and no one can seriously doubt that. I was just making the point that the team had a stellar run for 13 weeks but unfortunately had a shocker, as all teams can have, when it counted most. Because of that, there is no need to hit the red alert button - and it doesn't point to complacency that we couldn't land any big fish pre-draft.

[stik35]

I guess you need to discern the losses caused mainly by things that happened on the day and losses in which poor recruiting and poor administration played a major part. 2003 was the former, not the latter.

I was just making the point that the team had a stellar run for 13 weeks but unfortunately had a shocker, as all teams can have, when it counted most. Because of that, there is no need to hit the red alert button - and it doesn't point to complacency that we couldn't land any big fish pre-draft.

I fully agree with these sentiments, I am fed up with hearing people wanting to get rid of half the team or not wanting to renew memberships next year because of our Grand Final loss.

Do NOT forget the fantastic run we had leading up to the the finals and the huge games we played in the finals, beating Brisbane, beating Sydney up there against the odds, and (my personal favorite) murdering Port Adelaide.

We had been "up" for so long there was bound to be a loss - even Brisbane lost a few - it's just such a bummer that it happened on the most important day of the whole season.

Imagine how the players must feel - they never got to celebrate all those wins like we did because they always had to focus on the following week.

I always wonder how some supporters made it through the dark years in the late 90's when we won the wooden spoon.
Even if we finally win the big one, it's very unlikely that you can win year after year like Brisbane have and what will you do then?

[Big T]

Stik35, What would we do then? Hope that Carlton are still the laughing stock of the league and enjoy not having to listen to the "yadadadada" for another season! Developing a long term winning culture to me still seems to be the focus of the football department at McHale Stadium and although I don't agree with everything that has happened lately I am still convinced the next decade will be a ripper!

[Newelly]

I believe you misinterpreted Stik's post Big T. Stik wasn't condoning a philosophy of retaining sub-standard players. He seems to be saying that you don't sack half the team on the back of one bad performance. Also put that axe down. Queensland is already over-quota in homocidal maniacs.

[piedys]

Big T put that axe down. Queensland is already over-quota in homocidal maniacs.

Dr.Nick, that's not a very nice thing to say about Jason Acnemanis, and the hatchet job the little freak pulled on us last month.

[portadelaide]

I have read what everyone has said up to now.
Yes we are all pretty disappointed that we lost Scotland for so little and failed to get Stevens.
But Balme would be feeling pretty annoyed with those Port Adelaide bastards. He would feel real bad at the moment?

Fair Dinkum, all those years ago, when I followed passionately a Mark Williams' led Collingwood team, if Collingwood knew that he would turn around and bite this club in the arse, like he did this past week they should have pissed him off to the Bears earlier and given the captaincy to someone who is still passionate for the Black and White.

Chocko, you prick.
I hope your major sponsor pulls out from giving your club its money. I hope your fans and players grow to hate you, and your club falls out of the top 8.
May you not ever coach past 2004.
Bring on 2004 and lets beat those Port Adelaide pricks twice and stick it up their coach so far!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Meaningless dribble from a port supporter that is not worth even reading again
GO THE POWER-LESS

[Johnson#26]

Don't Port supporters have their own website?

[bokka]

So it's great to shockingly abuse and insult Port and Choke-O, but you can't stand to hear a reply?
Oh dear you poor delicate little things, I do hope your feelings are not too injured!

[Daks]

So it's great to shockingly abuse and insult Port and Choke-O, but you can't stand to hear a reply?
Oh dear you poor delicate little things, I do hope your feelings are not too injured!

Whats this sposed to be about?

[bokka]

I don't really care about it at all, it is just quite amusing that people want a sort of royal right to abuse without allowing a reply - sounds a bit like the Iraq media coverage come to think of it.