Alleged Australian war crimes in Afghanistan investigated

[David]

[watt price tully]

[think positive]

Who is the murderer? The officer or the poor sap who did as he was told?

I can’t imagine belong in that situation, im glad its not something I will ever have to contemplate.

It’s so so easy to judge from afar.

[David]

They both bear responsibility. Even the subordinate in that situation had the freedom to say no. What’s the worst that would have happened to him if he had?

I’m all for sympathy for killers but let’s not forget the real victims here.

[think positive]

They both bear responsibility. Even the subordinate in that situation had the freedom to say no. What’s the worst that would have happened to him if he had?

I’m all for sympathy for killers but let’s not forget the real victims here.

It’s called treason, or insubordination, you get shot for it. I’m not justifying their actions at all, but thankfully, I never walked in their shoes. And never had to make that choice.

And by the way, I have no sympathy for your every day garden variety killers ar all.

[watt price tully]

Guy Rundle as is often the case has explained this well framing the murders as an inherent part of the Australian male psyche and as part of the colonialist mentality:

https://www.crikey.com.au/2020/11/20/br ... newsletter

[Tannin]

They both bear responsibility. Even the subordinate in that situation had the freedom to say no. What’s the worst that would have happened to him if he had?

I’m all for sympathy for killers but let’s not forget the real victims here.

It’s called treason, or insubordination, you get shot for it. I’m not justifying their actions at all, but thankfully, I never walked in their shoes. And never had to make that choice.

And by the way, I have no sympathy for your every day garden variety killers ar all.

This has been tested in law many times, notably at the Nuremberg trials after the fall of Nazi Germany. The long and the short of it is that "just following orders" is not a valid defence. Plenty of concentration camp guards were hanged for "just following orders" - and rightly so.

Regardless of the requirement to follow orders, in any army, you have an overriding responsibility to stay within the rules of war. (And yes, that puts individual soldiers in some very difficult situations.)

[David]

[Lazza]

It is all about choice. Sometimes the choice is between the devil or the deep blue sea but it is still a choice. And just like TP, I would never like to find myself in such a daunting position.

[watt price tully]

In WW2 it wasn’t always as neat as following orders, see SS etc there was active and willing participation: that is well documented.

In Afghanistan it also wasn’t orders as well it was the action being allowed to occur with the tacit approval of those immediately higher up in the field.

The ABC needs to be congratulated on such brave reporting all those years ago and especially the brave whistleblowers.

Remember the Australian Federal Police (doing yet another political hatchet job on the opposition) through their staged intimidatory behaviours such as taking of computers in front of the alerted media.

The politicisation of the AFP under this mongrel of a Liberal government is a disgrace. The Army and the Libs have been trying to bury this for years.

[Tannin]

Agree with all of that, WPT. And Lazza. And David too. (Note that I was not trying to oversimplfy or minimise, simply clarify international law.

[David]

[watt price tully]

Geoffrey Robertson on the legal and moral issues from this as well as the cowardly US administration especially Trump and Nixon in the way they handled similar issues:

https://www.theage.com.au/national/just ... 56h1a.html

Again congratulations to the brave whistleblowers. Congratulations to the journalists from the ABC and The Age. What no Murdoch press

[think positive]

And congratulations to the 25,975 Australian soldiers who did the right thing and the 41 who made the ultimate sacrifice. Don’t cast them all with the same shadow

[Culprit]

There's no need for an further investigations or trial. Many have already found the alleged perpetrators guilty and ready to hang them. Trial by media.

Here's a list of the men that died for our country in that shithole. Not that you would give a toss.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_A ... fghanistan

7 of those were killed by a member of the afghan National Army. One of those responsible is walking or has walked free. Amazing but not surprising none of you are up in arms about that. None of you hangman have ever served let alone been under fire in any hostile act. None of you have ever witnessed your mate being shot dead by a so called friendly. Yet you sit in comfort and condemn their actions like you were there next to them.