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piffdog wrote:So if we end up post draft period with Lipinski, Kreuger, Daicos and Dib (who I dont know much about) woule people on this forum consider that a good outcome? No big name recruit - but I think we all know thats not possible, and potentially not the right move now given the list.
I'd be happy - and excited to see if our new coaching setup can MAKE some of these kids into superstars (not sure if the old coaching crew were the best developers of talent...)
Id be happy with Daicos, Dibb and Lipinski.
Kreuger a bonus that to me has the highlights but no consistency at AFL or VFL level. To get him for not much is ok but still very speculative.
IF we added Brander to that Id be very happy.
"Even when Im old and gray, I wont be able to play but Ill still love the game"
Michael Jordan
BazBoy wrote:Tom Wilson gets another rookie year due to Covid the 3 yr rookie rule has change to 4 yrs
And Ginnivan has signed a contract to stay at Pies
Happy with both
You look at Wilsons numbers in the VFL - I wonder why they dont look at him as a developing mid
"Even when Im old and gray, I wont be able to play but Ill still love the game"
Michael Jordan
BazBoy wrote:Tom Wilson gets another rookie year due to Covid the 3 yr rookie rule has change to 4 yrs
And Ginnivan has signed a contract to stay at Pies
Happy with both
You look at Wilsons numbers in the VFL - I wonder why they dont look at him as a developing mid
Agreed entirely Mr MJ23.
I think that, as with any new coaching regime, players will be tried in new positions.- would love to see Wilson on a wing - at 194cm and 86kgs with a decent tank he could be a real 'find'
Ginnivan has shown an ability to kick goals and he has decent length in his kicking. Kreuger is a long-kicking left footer as well.
I yearn for the days when Saverio & Anthony Rocca would launch from outside 50.
Firm in the belief that number 17 flag is only months away...
^ Wilson absolutely dominated one VFL game, playing at CHB. He was literally everywhere. There's been a massive gap between his VFL and AFL showings - but he looks to have everything necessary when you watch him at VFL level. Size, speed, ability to read the play and get to the ball, strong marking, kicking skills and the ability to get forward into dangerous positions, even when he's playing in a defensive role. I'm not saying he'll make it at AFL level - but I think people are too quick to dismiss players who don't make an instant transition from the VFL to the AFL. Some guys who look great in the seconds lack some specific attribute needed to make the jump (Danny Stanley's lack of pace is a good example - at VFL level, he looked like the reincarnation of Nathan Buckley but you knew he was never going to be a real star at senior level) but I don't see anything about Wilson in the VFL that screams "he won't make it" in that same way.
I should add, for clarity, that I'm not suggesting Wilson needs to play as a KPD - I'm just observing that he looks, in the VFL, like he can do a lot of things well.
^ agree - the other thing to note, he is coming from a fair way back being out of the AFL system in important years of development. If you take that into account he is developing well.
A new coaching group will either take him to the next level or finish him at AFL level. He has a great opportunity to have a say in which way he goes.
"Even when Im old and gray, I wont be able to play but Ill still love the game"
Michael Jordan
And that’s the thing withWilson and add that Senegal Bassirou Faye to players the new coaching staff will have to mould into reasonable to extra good AFL players
As everyone pointed out Tom Wilson started from away back but has shown enough to put more work into
The other I mentioned is even further back but with his enthusiasm and the coaching staff putting simalar work
To me it boils down to work / encouragement to everyone on the list is the backbone of our new coaching staff
With such a good influx in 2020, Nick Daicos, and possibly Lipinski , Wilson is lucky to have that extra Rookie year. He is not KP and was too far back imo to have warranted a spot on the list in the hope that unsurps other developing players.
So here we are.
I'm happy for him, and agree some people need more time, he does have the attributes and has shown a LOT of improvement. raw and unreliable.
His natural ability is good enough to have got this far. Looks to have a higher ceiling. Maybe more games is the gift he needs, and we will have a story to tell.
piffdog wrote:So if we end up post draft period with Lipinski, Kreuger, Daicos and Dib (who I dont know much about) would people on this forum consider that a good outcome?
No big name recruit - but I think we all know that's not possible, and potentially not the right move now given the list.
I'd be happy - and excited to see if our new coaching setup can MAKE some of these kids into superstars (not sure if the old coaching crew were the best developers of talent...)
Id be happy with Daicos, Dibb and Lipinski.
Kreuger a bonus that to me has the highlights but no consistency at AFL or VFL level. To get him for not much is ok but still very speculative.
IF we added Brander to that Id be very happy.
Closer.... still need to see if Riccardi elects to stay at GWS, and whether or not Wallis and/or Caddy need a change of environment too.
Otherwise, it's another bottom four finish in 2022, punctuated with mostly honourable losses, from an undersized list.
piffdog wrote:So if we end up post draft period with Lipinski, Kreuger, Daicos and Dib (who I dont know much about) would people on this forum consider that a good outcome?
No big name recruit - but I think we all know that's not possible, and potentially not the right move now given the list.
I'd be happy - and excited to see if our new coaching setup can MAKE some of these kids into superstars (not sure if the old coaching crew were the best developers of talent...)
Id be happy with Daicos, Dibb and Lipinski.
Kreuger a bonus that to me has the highlights but no consistency at AFL or VFL level. To get him for not much is ok but still very speculative.
IF we added Brander to that Id be very happy.
Closer.... still need to see if Riccardi elects to stay at GWS, and whether or not Wallis and/or Caddy need a change of environment too.
Otherwise, it's another bottom four finish in 2022, punctuated with mostly honourable losses, from an undersized list.
Dont mind Wallis
For me its either Ricardi or Kreuger not both. We need games into Begg, Johnson, McMahon and Henry.
Also, it dont matter much who we have up front if our mid depth isnt strong and settled - just by the lack of games experience for our elite talent alone plus a new coach/game plan suggests Bottom 4 is gonna be about right.
"Even when Im old and gray, I wont be able to play but Ill still love the game"
Michael Jordan
Harrysz wrote:How can we:
1. Get Lipinski from Western Bulldogs;
2. Get Kruger from Geelong;
3. Get Nick Daicos
without going into points deficit for 2022 and not further straining our salary cap?
Both players are out of contract, so the trades should come in as unders.
We could get both done with our future second and third rounders being involved ( and other bits and pieces being thrown in )
We could also walk one through to the PSD if the Cats or Dogs played hard ball.
I wouldn’t be too concerned, securing those three players is a fairly easy exercise to complete. I’ve said all along, there are no surprises here because the club has known for months Daicos will go either #1 or # 2. That’s the centre piece of entire draft strategy, so the pieces have long been put in place to make it happen.
Wallis or Dumont as free agents would be nice.
I like them both as being part of their clubs leadership groups too.
The list is so young. You want big bodies and strong leadership around the kids on the ground.
I don’t see Dumont leaving when the dust settles but they do some strange things at the Kangas, so anything is possible.
Gary Player “ the harder I practice, the luckier I get “
MJ23 wrote:
Kreuger a bonus that to me has the highlights but no consistency at AFL or VFL level. To get him for not much is ok but still very speculative.
IF we added Brander to that Id be very happy.
Closer.... still need to see if Riccardi elects to stay at GWS, and whether or not Wallis and/or Caddy need a change of environment too.
Otherwise, it's another bottom four finish in 2022, punctuated with mostly honourable losses, from an undersized list.
Dont mind Wallis
For me its either Ricardi or Kreuger not both. We need games into Begg, Johnson, McMahon and Henry.
Also, it dont matter much who we have up front if our mid depth isnt strong and settled - just by the lack of games experience for our elite talent alone plus a new coach/game plan suggests Bottom 4 is gonna be about right.
Okay - so two of either Kreuger / Brander / Riccardi, would give us sufficient spinal structure to build around.
I'm also counting on a full VFL season to allow Begg, McMahon and perhaps Henry, to develop in. The reality is, they are simply too light at present.
Johnson should be able to take the immediate impact of AFL, and really should have been left in SANFL comp to maintain his 2021 form AFTER we drafted him, with no VFL comp to participate in; utter madness.
Even if we do snaffle Lipinski, we need another solid bodied mid, and cheap; thus I crap on about Wallis and Caddy, and their current lack of opportunity.
Pies4shaw wrote:^ Wilson absolutely dominated one VFL game, playing at CHB. He was literally everywhere. There's been a massive gap between his VFL and AFL showings - but he looks to have everything necessary when you watch him at VFL level. Size, speed, ability to read the play and get to the ball, strong marking, kicking skills and the ability to get forward into dangerous positions, even when he's playing in a defensive role. I'm not saying he'll make it at AFL level - but I think people are too quick to dismiss players who don't make an instant transition from the VFL to the AFL. Some guys who look great in the seconds lack some specific attribute needed to make the jump (Danny Stanley's lack of pace is a good example - at VFL level, he looked like the reincarnation of Nathan Buckley but you knew he was never going to be a real star at senior level) but I don't see anything about Wilson in the VFL that screams "he won't make it" in that same way.
I should add, for clarity, that I'm not suggesting Wilson needs to play as a KPD - I'm just observing that he looks, in the VFL, like he can do a lot of things well.
Agreed. Given he has had only about 20 opportunities since signing on as a basketballer mid 2019, it has been remarkable and understated by many on Nicks. He has had some Reserve games of upwards of 30 possessions and some on-ball time. Would love to see everyone be patient and compare his career trajectory to Alex Keath who switched sports. Might just be the surprise packet of 2022.
