Nick's Collingwood Bulletin Board

In every trade topic I read, everyone seems to keep offering up Presti as trade bait. Now as far as I understand it, trade bait can be defined as a player that would be valuable to other clubs, but whose loss would not really be felt by one's own club.

So would Presti's loss be felt by Collingwood, especially as his likely replacement would be a skillful midfielder?

Well if Presti went, who would be our number one negating defender to play on their best forward, ie Lloyd, Tredrea, Brown? Well Clement is too short (as we saw when Tredrea, ie Presti's bitch, hammered him in Rd 21). Wakelin is a possibility but is the 2nd older player at the club. Maybe Cloke will get there in time, but do we really want Cloke playing on Matthew Lloyd? No he's a quality defender but his one-on-one skills are nowhere near good enough. Oh and Walker is a possibility but is clearly too young at this stage. So we find that we dont really have an adequate replacement for Presti, at this stage we would be short in defence if he was traded.

Ok, but what if we gained a skillful midfielder. Well the bare facts are that clubs will bust a gut to get a key position player, while midfielders are much easier to create. To demonstrate here are the skillful players that our club will definitely have playing in midfield next year - Johnson, Didak, Davis. I'm sure I dont need to remind everyone that Johnson got the most Brownlow votes for us this year. So clearly, if we didn't get a new skillful midfielder it would not be that great a loss.

I should probably mention that one area where we aren't lacking at all is in attack - in Rocca, Tarrant, C Cloke, Fraser, Davidson we have some quality talls. In Fraser we have a player that is a lot like Nick Riewoldt and would surely be capable of holding down CHF.

So why isnt anyone suggesting that we trade Rocca?

Clearly people dont appreciate what full backs are worth.

We should trade Rocca, he's past his best, injuries will restrict him in the future.

Rocca could be worth trading. But his presence and, when on top of his game, can cause problems to other teams defences. Also if we take him out do we move Tarrant into a CHF role. And who do we move down to FF?
Rocca is now only 27 and this is about the time when big men really influence games. It would have to0 be a good trade for us to give up Rocca but it is feasible.

Why Presti? Well, HotPies, for what its worth, my own analysis (see separate article on the website if you can be bothered reading it) is that we have far too many "medium tall" backmen and no true "tall" backmen and that we have been hurt too frequently when Presti and Wakes try to play on the true tall forwards, so said we needed to develop them.

I saw Tex moving into that role next season, and possibly Crow or Hall, although it is far too early in their development to make that judgement. However, even if only Tex makes it (and it's my opinion he will start at FB or CHB next season), then one of Wakes or Presti is out of a job. I reasoned that we could retain one on our list but not both.

Looking at their attributes, Presti is too one-dimensional ie he can only play FB, and too slow, whereas Wakes, although now 30 and reaching the end of his career, is far more mobile and is the better option to retain as a backup, as he can fill other roles in defence as well. Also, because Presti is only 26, he has trade value, whereas Wakes has none because of his age.

Therefore, if we find we cannot keep both on our list (which is very possible) then it makes sense to see if we can trade Presti to another club.

I see where your coming from HotPies but the truth is, Presti is expendable. He is a solid player, who is capable of locking down some of the games best forwards. But his problem is his lack of pace, aging body, injury and lack of abillity to set up play from defence. Although it is his role to keep the opposition quiet, prehaps he could work on winning his own ball. I like him, and hope he stays, as he is an underrated player but if the club get an offer, they may use him.

As for Rocca, I think that if a deal came up which meant we got a player youner and was a centre half forward, it may be worth a shot. McDougall for Rocca? No.

Cannibal, I agree with everything you said with the exception if Justin Crow, simply put, I can't see him on the list next year.

Is it possible to drop Crow back to the rookie list for next year or do we need to go through the rookie draft to get him?

I agree Cannibal, but I think Presti should get one more year as Tex and Hall improve.

I think Crow might be too old to be a rookie next season. He's been on our rookie list at least four years now. He will be cut.

With Presti, I'm not sure where this 'he's not tall enough to take the true forwards' is coming from because when he was on his game a few years ago he was beating more full forwards than any other full back in the league and had the best 'against' ratio of goals kicked in the league.

My personal fear with Presti after seeing him in 2004 is that he will not regain this form. Yes he was always coming back from injury this year but even after he had been eased back and after a few weeks he was still really struggling with the tempo and struggling with body contact. There is definitely hope that after an injury free pre-season he may find his rhythm again but personally for me with the emergence of Maxwell and Walker I wouldn't risk having Presti hit the scrap pile next season and I'd trade him while we still can.

I would trade him to melbourne for bruce, that would be about it

This has been something that has had me puzzled for a while now. Although Presti doesnt rack up the possies or marks neither does his opponent. He has made many of the competitions stars his bitch(most notably Tredrea).

But what im most concerned about is that if Presti who has about 4-5 years left is traded and Wakes retires in 1 or 2 years what happens then? Every backline needs experience. And going by Cannibals prediction we would have Tex/Hall/Cloke filling FB and CHB. This is way to much of a risk to gamble on 3 young guys to hold down the fort with no experience to help.

Just My Opinion.

Trading Rocca are you serious no f***ing way. Call me sentimental but when he's on he is one of the best players to watch.

[quote="Johnson#26"]I see where your coming from HotPies but the truth is, Presti is expendable. He is a solid player, who is capable of locking down some of the games best forwards. But his problem is his lack of pace, aging body, injury and lack of abillity to set up play from defence. Although it is his role to keep the opposition quiet, prehaps he could work on winning his own ball. I like him, and hope he stays, as he is an underrated player but if the club get an offer, they may use him.
You're getting demented.

McDougall is not a deal I would do. He is still a couple of years away.

rocca still has some very good football ahead of him, a few people are jumping off to quick

Some interesting replies guys. My point wasn't necessarily that Rocca should be traded. It was simply that too many people are forgetting how essential Presti is to our team, yes as essential as Rocca is. He doesnt win a lot of the ball, thats true - but look at Mal Michael, he doesnt either, but that hasnt stopped him from being one of the top 2 fullbacks in the comp. My most important argument is this. Presti is the best player we have at stopping the oppostition star forward from kicking goals, if he goes there isnt anyone we can slot in to his place. People clearly have short memories and forget how good he is when he isnt injured. Remember 2002 when he conceded the least goals of any fullback in the comp?

Of-course every player can be traded if a good enough offer eventuates, but there would have to be a pretty damn good offer to trade Presti.

Memories and sentiment are irrelevant in today's game. What Presti did in 2002 or earlier doesn't count when you are looking at improving the list for next year. Also, it should have no impact on whether you consider trading him. If the best anyone can come up with is what he once did, how good he once was, then the issue is surely settled - trade him now whilst he has some trade value left.