Rehab vs punishment
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stui magpie
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Rehab vs punishment
Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down.
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Mugwump
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Only a fool would not want some kind of rehabilitation of prisoners. The question is whether this is achieved by making prison a place of austere, uncomfortable discipline and re-education, or whether it is best achieved by PlayStations, large doses of human rights, gyms, days out and drugs which seem to be the programme in many of our prisons today.
You have to do some pretty unpleasant things to go into prison today. Does anyone have any data which shows that soft "rehab" actually works better for the prisoner or community, than a hard, unyielding regime of education and indoctrination designed to reinforce self-discipline and obedience to lawful authority ?
Again, I urge anyone who can find it to watch the current .channel 4 programme on Durham prison. It is British, but I do not think the conditions it describes are so different from those in Australia. There is no real respect for the law or authority in that place, just a game. The lax regime is making no one any happier or safer. Any attempt to reform it is usually labeled "authoritarian", but it is not "authoritarian" to hate crime and want to see it punished, or to want lawless thugs to come to heel. No one is more authoritarian than a violent or repeated criminal.
On this specific case, he sounds like a limited risk to the community, but if he got 9 years I would not be granting him any "out" rights until much later in his sentence. Prison is about due punishment of responsible individuals AND rehabilitation. This seems to me to prioritise the latter over the former.
You have to do some pretty unpleasant things to go into prison today. Does anyone have any data which shows that soft "rehab" actually works better for the prisoner or community, than a hard, unyielding regime of education and indoctrination designed to reinforce self-discipline and obedience to lawful authority ?
Again, I urge anyone who can find it to watch the current .channel 4 programme on Durham prison. It is British, but I do not think the conditions it describes are so different from those in Australia. There is no real respect for the law or authority in that place, just a game. The lax regime is making no one any happier or safer. Any attempt to reform it is usually labeled "authoritarian", but it is not "authoritarian" to hate crime and want to see it punished, or to want lawless thugs to come to heel. No one is more authoritarian than a violent or repeated criminal.
On this specific case, he sounds like a limited risk to the community, but if he got 9 years I would not be granting him any "out" rights until much later in his sentence. Prison is about due punishment of responsible individuals AND rehabilitation. This seems to me to prioritise the latter over the former.
Two more flags before I die!
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Culprit
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The three R's - Retribution Retribution Retribution.
We have a majority of people sucked in by the media seeking retribution. The days of breaking rocks are over, we worked out that never worked and made criminals into super hardened criminals. Many deem prison as a holiday camp and they get that perception from the media. If you've never been inside a prison you are clueless. It's so good in prison, everyone is trying to avoid going in there and the one's in there are trying everything to get out. We have gone backwards with Private Prisons as it's in their interest for people to re offend as they make money per head.
Interesting that we have had a one punch killer playing football on the weekend under conditions and the media run around like chooks with their heads cut off. This has been happening for decades and never been an issue. He has to be released back into society at the end of his sentence. This is about rehab and adjustment. He can't have a drink with the boys after a game, it's play the match and then back to prison.
Another one punch killer talking to VCE students about his experience and ramifications and the media run the hysteria campaign again.
You kick someone like a dog everyday in prison and then release them, that dog is going to bite you.
"The degree of civilization in a society can be judged by entering it's prisons" Fyodor Dostoevsky.
We have a majority of people sucked in by the media seeking retribution. The days of breaking rocks are over, we worked out that never worked and made criminals into super hardened criminals. Many deem prison as a holiday camp and they get that perception from the media. If you've never been inside a prison you are clueless. It's so good in prison, everyone is trying to avoid going in there and the one's in there are trying everything to get out. We have gone backwards with Private Prisons as it's in their interest for people to re offend as they make money per head.
Interesting that we have had a one punch killer playing football on the weekend under conditions and the media run around like chooks with their heads cut off. This has been happening for decades and never been an issue. He has to be released back into society at the end of his sentence. This is about rehab and adjustment. He can't have a drink with the boys after a game, it's play the match and then back to prison.
Another one punch killer talking to VCE students about his experience and ramifications and the media run the hysteria campaign again.
You kick someone like a dog everyday in prison and then release them, that dog is going to bite you.
"The degree of civilization in a society can be judged by entering it's prisons" Fyodor Dostoevsky.
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Skids
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It's very scary!Culprit wrote:Tell me how wonderful it is inside. Give me your insights from your time in prison.
I've been in a few, not as an inmate, as a plumber fixing stuff.
Bandyup (WA's womens prison) was an eye opener
The inmates are like a pack of bitches on heat! I would have been raped and murdered if left by myself in there! Some of the things they said they were going to do to me sounded like fun, but other stuff made me shake in my steel caps.Acacia (Medium security mens prison) was pretty mellow in comparison. I went in to a cell to fix the toilet, dude in there was pretty chilled just reading his book. I had to wait for a guard to come and get me in an exercise area, blokes were having a game of basketball. Everyone seemed pretty happy, most of them were related I think.
Greenough Prison (Low security mixed) Did some laundry A/C up grades here. Spoke with and had lunch with inmates here. Very mellow place, one inmate I spoke with was a sheep farmer. Times were tough so he planted a few cannabis plants, like about 3 acres worth! Others were in for traffic offences, burglaries and minor drug charges.
Inmates here were very relaxed, the women and men seemed to enjoy each others company, I witnessed favours exchanged for smokes. Not too bad a place from what I could tell.
Don't count the days, make the days count.
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Dave The Man
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stui magpie
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^
You've missed the point there Dave, it's not about sending someone to a drug rehab place instead of gaol, it's about when someone gets sent to gaol and what is the outcome we want?
Do we want them to go to gaol and just be punished the whole time, or do we want them to be rehabilitated inside so they can come out not a criminal anymore.
The OP was about a bloke in gaol, allowed out on Saturday to play local footy as part of a rehab program, a reward for good behaviour, and people lost their minds over it because they think he should be locked away for his whole sentence.
You've missed the point there Dave, it's not about sending someone to a drug rehab place instead of gaol, it's about when someone gets sent to gaol and what is the outcome we want?
Do we want them to go to gaol and just be punished the whole time, or do we want them to be rehabilitated inside so they can come out not a criminal anymore.
The OP was about a bloke in gaol, allowed out on Saturday to play local footy as part of a rehab program, a reward for good behaviour, and people lost their minds over it because they think he should be locked away for his whole sentence.
Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down.
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Dave The Man
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Not just to be look like the Victim because they Decided to get into Drugs and Alchol.stui magpie wrote:^
You've missed the point there Dave, it's not about sending someone to a drug rehab place instead of gaol, it's about when someone gets sent to gaol and what is the outcome we want?
Do we want them to go to gaol and just be punished the whole time, or do we want them to be rehabilitated inside so they can come out not a criminal anymore.
The OP was about a bloke in gaol, allowed out on Saturday to play local footy as part of a rehab program, a reward for good behaviour, and people lost their minds over it because they think he should be locked away for his whole sentence.
You Sentenced to Jail you stay in Jail until Time is Up or Get Bail like anyone can get it seems
I am Da Man
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What'sinaname
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Mugwump
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Again, only a fool would not want rehabilitation in prison. But it is clearly not the same thing as continually making jails more pleasant, since we have been making jails more pleasant since Victorian times while recidivism (currently 45% within two years) has risen in that time. You can have any view you like, but facts will demand to be heard in the end.
As for the straw man that "treating people like animals" causes trouble, well, of course. But no one is advocating that as a policy.
There are clearly different types of prisoners, of course. Minor, one-time offenders, or those whose crimes were unintentional (careless driving, etc) should have conditions which are less intensive. Those with repeat offences or violence need character reformation and sequestration from the public.
As for the straw man that "treating people like animals" causes trouble, well, of course. But no one is advocating that as a policy.
There are clearly different types of prisoners, of course. Minor, one-time offenders, or those whose crimes were unintentional (careless driving, etc) should have conditions which are less intensive. Those with repeat offences or violence need character reformation and sequestration from the public.
Two more flags before I die!