Not happy Pies
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surfer1
Joined: 18 May 2004
Location: Sydney ex Ararat
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| AN_Inkling wrote: | | They could have backed up their talk with action. |
What action would you suggest? |
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Brenny
Joined: 05 Apr 2011
Location: Westpac Centre
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^ I don't think it was the fact that none of them wanted to come here, I think it had more to do with Brisbane playing hardball and not wanting to trade them.
My opinion is, once a player says they want to leave and they nominate a club, the club they nominate is in the box seat for a good deal.
My opinion is, Collingwood played very hard ball trying to scare Brisbane into a trade and full credit to them, they stood their ground.
The talk of a deadline was just talk. Collingwood are well aware that Beams will eventually walk so they may aswell get something for him now, before he moves on.
Beams was gone, regardless. I remember when he was recruited, the talk of him going home started that day.
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Heeeeeeeeeeeeeey, we want some Bayley! |
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AN_Inkling
Joined: 06 Oct 2007
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| Wokko wrote: |
I've said all this previously but people just want to believe what they want to believe. Common sense and the truth just wont come into it. They'll shout NO DEAL and think they've got a direct line to the recruiting people.
If none of their players wanted to come here, then WTF could they do? Crisp volunteered but was happy to stay at Brisbane, maybe none of their other players wanted to come here?
I think we've broken even (Greenwood + Crisp) before even taking Pick 5 into the mix. If pick 5 is a star (Pendles was @ 5) then we'll come out way, way in front, much like the Eagles with Judd. |
Greenwood and Crisp for Beams is breaking even? 
Here's some more detail on what we could have, and said we would, do:
| Magpies Nest wrote: | I haven't posted here for a long time but I still read with interest and I would like someone who is disappointed in the clubs handling of this trade tell me how the following issues could have been overcome:
1. To open negotiations with other clubs, Beams would have to agree to go there. Clearly he didn't.
2. To "get" Aish, or Redden,or Rich, or Rockliff, they would have had to agree to come to Collingwood. Clearly they didn't.
The deal may not be your idea of acceptable, but when a player declares he wants to leave a club, it's a rare (not impossible) thing for that club to "win" the trade.
What else could the club have done? |
1. For Beams to get to Brisbane we have to agree to trade him there. He's under contract. Our statement on Friday suggested we'd break off negotiations with Brisbane and take offers from other clubs. Clearly we didn't. Our only chance of getting a fair deal was to close the door on Brisbane, make it clear to Beams he's not going there. Once that had sunk in he very well may have considered moving the Gold Coast or the Giants. We won't know now, because it seems we caved for what's looking like a weak deal (only reportedly to this point, so there is still hope). We buckled whereas the Lions and Beams held their ground.
2. It's rare to win a trade when a player declares a team, because they're usually out of contract. In this case, with Beams under contract, we could have been stronger. Our words were strong, but if we've accepted the deal as reported our actions did not back them up. The deal is definitely below cost and it's perfectly reasonable to be disappointed with it. Looking likely that the Dogs will get a better deal for Griffen who is 4 years older.
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Well done boys!
Last edited by AN_Inkling on Mon Oct 13, 2014 6:53 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Wokko 
Come and take it.
Joined: 04 Oct 2005
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Yeah, lets hold a player to a contract who'll turn up to play, sook around the locker room and cause trouble.
He was gone, and waiting a year to trade him would've been an unmitigated disaster. We could've even (slight chance) been Luke Ball'd. |
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Museman
Joined: 06 Jul 2009
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| AN_Inkling wrote: | | Wokko wrote: |
I've said all this previously but people just want to believe what they want to believe. Common sense and the truth just wont come into it. They'll shout NO DEAL and think they've got a direct line to the recruiting people.
If none of their players wanted to come here, then WTF could they do? Crisp volunteered but was happy to stay at Brisbane, maybe none of their other players wanted to come here?
I think we've broken even (Greenwood + Crisp) before even taking Pick 5 into the mix. If pick 5 is a star (Pendles was @ 5) then we'll come out way, way in front, much like the Eagles with Judd. |
Greenwood and Crisp for Beams is breaking even?
Here's some more detail on what we could have, and said we would, do:
| Magpies Nest wrote: | I haven't posted here for a long time but I still read with interest and I would like someone who is disappointed in the clubs handling of this trade tell me how the following issues could have been overcome:
1. To open negotiations with other clubs, Beams would have to agree to go there. Clearly he didn't.
2. To "get" Aish, or Redden,or Rich, or Rockliff, they would have had to agree to come to Collingwood. Clearly they didn't.
The deal may not be your idea of acceptable, but when a player declares he wants to leave a club, it's a rare (not impossible) thing for that club to "win" the trade.
What else could the club have done? |
1. For Beams to get to Brisbane we have to agree to trade him there. He's under contract. Our statement on Friday suggested we'd break off negotiations with Brisbane and take offers from other clubs. Clearly we didn't. Our only chance of getting a fair deal was to close the door on Brisbane, make it clear to Beams he's not going there. Once that had sunk in he very well may have considered moving the Gold Coast or the Giants. We won't know now, because it seems we caved for what's looking like a weak deal (only reportedly to this point, so there is still hope). We buckled whereas the Lions and Beams held their ground.
2. It's rare to win a trade when a player declares a team, because they're usually out of contract. In this case, with Beams under contract, we could have been stronger. Our words were strong, but if we've accepted the deal as reported our actions did not back them up. The deal is definitely below cost and it's perfectly reasonable to be disappointed with it. Looking likely that the Dogs will get a better deal for Griffen who is 4 years older. |
Not to mention start watching our boys with a year to go on their contract...
They've just watched how to in getting your own way.
Sometimes for the good of the future you need to draw a line and set an example, no matter the cost.
WEAK. |
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AN_Inkling
Joined: 06 Oct 2007
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| Wokko wrote: | Yeah, lets hold a player to a contract who'll turn up to play, sook around the locker room and cause trouble.
He was gone, and waiting a year to trade him would've been an unmitigated disaster. We could've even (slight chance) been Luke Ball'd. |
How come only Brisbane and Beams can hold their ground?
Brisbane could have missed out on getting him altogether, but they didn't cave.
Beams could have been forced to stay, but he didn't cave and look to other teams. Though we didn't put much pressure on him to do this, just a confected media statement that was clearly seen for the bluff that it was.
We said all along that our first choice was to keep Beams. Was this a lie? We also said we'd cut off negotiations with Brisbane on Friday. Was this a lie? How about only accepting a fair deal that included an established player. Was this a lie?
I don't want Beams to stay, but if we wanted fair compensation for our second best player, we needed that option to be on the table. Empty words are not enough. If Beams really didn't wan't to be at Collingwood he'd look to other clubs once negotiations with Brisbane broke down. If he wouldn't look at other clubs, including Gold Coast, then clearly he doesn't want to leave that badly and we keep our second best player. This was the only workable strategy, and we'd played it perfectly up until Friday. Since then we seem to have gotten cold feet and agreed to an offer which is only a bag of chips more than the one we rejected last week. Not much of a face save.
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Well done boys! |
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loki04 
Tiger Treloar lmfao NOPE.
Joined: 10 Apr 2005
Location: Broken Hill
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| Brenny wrote: | ^ I don't think it was the fact that none of them wanted to come here, I think it had more to do with Brisbane playing hardball and not wanting to trade them.
My opinion is, once a player says they want to leave and they nominate a club, the club they nominate is in the box seat for a good deal.
My opinion is, Collingwood played very hard ball trying to scare Brisbane into a trade and full credit to them, they stood their ground.
The talk of a deadline was just talk. Collingwood are well aware that Beams will eventually walk so they may aswell get something for him now, before he moves on.
Beams was gone, regardless. I remember when he was recruited, the talk of him going home started that day. |
Much like Broomhead who it appeared was borderline on leaving and may still at end of next contract.
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Up the Mighty Mags 2016. |
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loki04
Tiger Treloar lmfao NOPE.
Joined: 10 Apr 2005
Location: Broken Hill
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Beams is the one who fcuked us, he refused to go anywhere but Brisbane giving them all the leverage and Collingwood left standing their with dick in hand.
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Up the Mighty Mags 2016. |
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Museman
Joined: 06 Jul 2009
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| loki04 wrote: | | Brenny wrote: | ^ I don't think it was the fact that none of them wanted to come here, I think it had more to do with Brisbane playing hardball and not wanting to trade them.
My opinion is, once a player says they want to leave and they nominate a club, the club they nominate is in the box seat for a good deal.
My opinion is, Collingwood played very hard ball trying to scare Brisbane into a trade and full credit to them, they stood their ground.
The talk of a deadline was just talk. Collingwood are well aware that Beams will eventually walk so they may aswell get something for him now, before he moves on.
Beams was gone, regardless. I remember when he was recruited, the talk of him going home started that day. |
Much like Broomhead who it appeared was borderline on leaving and may still at end of next contract. |
Well he knows how to go about it now. |
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watt price tully 
Joined: 15 May 2007
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| Defender wrote: | | swoop42 wrote: | Well it's 6:15 and still no deal announced.
So either:
1.We've rejected the Lions revised offer.
2.Clubs are still haggling over the draft picks involved in the "mega club" deal.
3.The club is trying to save a little face in not being seen as signing off on this trade at the earliest opportunity.
I'm hoping for option 1 but expect it might be option 2. |
The club leaked the deal last night, now their giving us a few days to get used to it, they are treating us like muppets IMO,..... |
It seems the club then knows some of its members.
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“I even went as far as becoming a Southern Baptist until I realised they didn’t keep ‘em under long enough” Kinky Friedman |
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MatthewBoydFanClub
Joined: 12 Feb 2007
Location: Elwood
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Yeah, why does this only happen to Collingwood? Brisbane should just relent and give us pick 5, Aish, Rich and Redden. So it's really easy. Pert rings up Swan and says you can have Beams, but we want pick 5, Aish, Rich and Redden. Swan says, is that all you want? Let's sign on the bottom line now. Problem solved. Who needs two weeks of trading negotiations? Everything can be be sorted out in the first day.
Ryder wants out of Essendon. Griffen wants out at the Bulldogs. Boyd wants out at GWS.
Yeah. Why does this only happen at Collingwood? |
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richo
Joined: 06 Sep 2004
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| A crap trade if true, we have been bent over, and beams has played us like a puppet. |
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Stinger
Joined: 01 Dec 2003
Location: Canberra
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| Has he actually been traded yet? |
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3rd degree 
Joined: 22 Jun 2004
Location: John Wren's tote
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| richo wrote: | | A crap trade if true, we have been bent over, and beams has played us like a puppet. |
agreed very shit trade
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" Ohhh Banksy and out comes the Note Book".
www.facebook/the hybernators |
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Stinger
Joined: 01 Dec 2003
Location: Canberra
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| loki04 wrote: | | Brenny wrote: | ^ I don't think it was the fact that none of them wanted to come here, I think it had more to do with Brisbane playing hardball and not wanting to trade them.
My opinion is, once a player says they want to leave and they nominate a club, the club they nominate is in the box seat for a good deal.
My opinion is, Collingwood played very hard ball trying to scare Brisbane into a trade and full credit to them, they stood their ground.
The talk of a deadline was just talk. Collingwood are well aware that Beams will eventually walk so they may aswell get something for him now, before he moves on.
Beams was gone, regardless. I remember when he was recruited, the talk of him going home started that day. |
Much like Broomhead who it appeared was borderline on leaving and may still at end of next contract. |
Do you know him personally and is that the case?
%$^$%^&%% me, you'd think we had 8,000 members, crap facilities and played in front of 6,000 fan a week. Oh wait that's GWS. |
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