Beams contract talks
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Pies4shaw 
pies4shaw
Joined: 08 Oct 2007
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| And so will Beamer. |
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E
Joined: 05 May 2010
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| 35forever wrote: | | MJ23 wrote: | ^ agree
Even though he wont ask for what he is deserving.
Im sure I read at the last contract neg he sacked his management company as they were not moving quick enough.
You put his development, attitude and club loyalty up against Dale's and you realise the supporters idolised the wrong bloke.
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Sorry, but I can't let this kind of hypocrisy pass, and yes, denigrating a great Collingwood player and criticising his loyalty in the same sentence is indeed hypocrisy! You do NOT know DT wanted to leave, I know he wanted to stay.
DT was in a very different position to Dayne. Collingwood is determined to keep Dayne and were determined to dump Dale. His popularity was a threat to Buckley & Buckley is known to have disliked the so-called "Brat Pack" since his playing days,. He has eliminated every member of it except for Swanny, (although Pendles was a member early and so was Dayne to an extent, but Pendles opted to be a team leader - and thank god he did - and Dayne followed suit - and thank god he did!) Another big difference is that DT & Bucks played together for a couple of seasons. Also while your talking about loyalty, DT was one of the first to accept less to stay at Collingwood. He definitely wanted to be a magpie for life, but his rift with Buckley put an end to that. To suggest that we are better without him is ridiculous. He was BOG in his last full game for us (StKilda last year), and we only have 5 guys with over 150 games in the side, three with over 200, and we'll likely lose two of those fairly soon, only Tooves is likely to join the 150 club in that time
I have no wish to turn this into another DT thread, but I WILL answer any question on the matter & respond to any weak attempt at abuse.
Back to Beamer, there is no doubt the kid is a gun, and we still haven't seen the best of him given that he's only 24. If Collingwood were silly enough to offer him unders simply because he wants to stay, it would be a monumental mistake. I have no doubt he could get 800's at any of half a dozen clubs, the guy is already in the top 5 players in Fantasy Football, and his form is getting better by the week. If we offer 200 and he knows he can get 800, he'd be foolish not to look at it. Loyalty, in the end, must have a price, especially when ones career is so brief & could end at any moment. And let's face it, there's no superannuation or pension plan. When Collingwood or any other team has finished with any player they may as well not exist, unless the player is one of the very few who achieve 'legend' status. |
I agree the pies didn't want him, but I disagree with your logic.
I think the simple reason we let daisy go is because of a simple risk reward analysis. He is not the player he was and was demanding to be paid (rightly so because Carlton offered it to him), Elite money. He was elite in 2010. Maybe our most valuable player. Not the same after the injury.
This fact pattern made it impossible for the pies to pay him and impossible for Daisy to stay.
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Ohhh, the Premiership's a cakewalk ....... |
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Stupied
Joined: 14 Mar 2013
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| 35forever wrote: | | If we offer 200 and he knows he can get 800, he'd be foolish not to look at it. Loyalty, in the end, must have a price, especially when ones career is so brief & could end at any moment. And let's face it, there's no superannuation or pension plan. When Collingwood or any other team has finished with any player they may as well not exist, unless the player is one of the very few who achieve 'legend' status. |
Dayne is already being paid well over 200k and is one of our best players. If you want people to take you seriously, stop posting such retarded statements. |
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HAL
Please don't shout at me - I can't help it.
Joined: 17 Mar 2003
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| If I had people to take you stop posting such retarded statements what would I do with it? |
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35forever
"I feel sick - dada dada dada da"
Joined: 23 Feb 2005
Location: Physical=Sunshine Coast -- Mental=Vic Park
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Wow, my sanity wasn't questioned! Just my value at parties. I do appreciate a couple of you putting forth actual arguments so I'll be (relatively) brief.
First, there does appear to be a fairly well documented discord between DT & Bucks, but I never believe that in such things all the blame is on one side, so no, I don't lay all the blame on Buckley. They were just very different people. If DT thought he could outlast Buckley then I agree, he was foolish, but I don't believe that was his plan.
The other point was about DT's skill & ability, Go watch his last full game, he was brilliant & easily BOG for mine, don't take my word, look. I do concede that the admin did take his injury into account, but only because it provided a viable rationale for letting the most player in the side go. I feel greatly for him because he wanted to be a 'pie for life, and looks incredibly uncomfortable in Navy blue, So does heater in orange (but who wouldn’t). I do have a better memory than most and I remember that one-handed pick up & goal on the sprint against StKilda, The torp from the 50M fence in the incredible 2011 comeback against Adelaide, the amazing candy salesmanship in the goal square during the 2010 GF, and many other astounding feats of skill. Until that injury he was improving each week, so no, I won't concede for one second that declining skill or team value played any part. I really do believe that if his return last year had gone as planned we would have been much harder to beat in the last part of last year. Guys like that can turn a game, and he will do that for Carlton. He was among their best against Adelaide, although still finding his way there.
DT was a lighthearted, very funny guy and was well loved by all the players because he combined that with exceptional skill. Buckley is a hard-nosed, head down guy who believed that hard work could fix any problem. Neither is wrong or right, just very different. DTs immense popularity was a problem, they STILL have a "Thommo's Team" junior membership for sale, I expect they now refer it to Josh or maybe Len, they don't actually say. He would have taken less than Carlton's offer to stay at Collingwood, he's actually quite intelligent and understood the value of that. He was making good money from ads etc at Collingwood, and knew he had a great future in the media as a Collingwood premiership champion. He's not dumb enough to think that Carlton will be adding to their flag tally any time soon.
Beamer, on the other hand, and I'm sure QldMagpie will agree, is quite different, he doesn't have the media skill or confidence of Daisy, and would be better suited to coaching when he retires (hopefully in ten years!). He WILL however be a multiple premiership Collingwood champion when that day comes, I'll bet my left...arm on it.
I'll say no more about Daisy in this thread, (I'll start another if need be) it's supposed to be about Beamer. all I can say is watch his last games before suggesting he was 'washed up'
yeah, not as brief as I promised, sorry!
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-me, 2010
"The pies are going to the big dance!"-P.Daicos 2010
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woftam 
I used to be undecided, but now I'm not so sure.
Joined: 28 Jul 2008
Location: Carum Downs, Vic
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| Not sure he is immensely popular any more 35 forever. Judging by the way he tried to get under Luke Ball's skin after he smothered his kick & then our new skipper proceeded to sit him on his arse. I think our players & coaching staff have moved on quite quickly. It's only some fans that haven't. Was a great player for us but he wears a vile jumper now. I'll never hate the guy. He will always be a Collingwood premiership player, but I think the correct decision was made for the list & for our future by the club. Sometimes tough decisions have to be made. |
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Stupied
Joined: 14 Mar 2013
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| Quote: | | they STILL have a "Thommo's Team" junior membership for sale |
Nope. They replaced Thommos Team with Magpie Stars within days of him going. Once again you're talking out your arse. |
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Az
Joined: 25 Sep 2013
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| 35forever doing his best to turn this Beamer thread into another Daisy got screwed thread. Sigh |
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The Prototype 
Paint my face with a good-for-nothin smile.
Joined: 23 Apr 2003
Location: Hobart, Tasmania
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qldmagpie67
Joined: 18 Dec 2008
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I don't want to get involved in a DT was screwed arguement but his gone and we have moved on.
To the other point 35 made on Dayne accepting $200k is ludicrous as he is on around $350k now.
The whole point of him instructing his management to start talks now is this stuff can take some time. He isn't off contract until end of 2015 but he wants it to be a non issue next season hence the early talks.
Gary Pert will know full well Dayne's market value which could go up and up depending on who is available under free agency.
Dayne is fully aware both Pendles and Swanny accepted less money to stay loyal to the club.
I'm sure Perty will make a very reasonable offer and while there may be a bit of back and forth to get a final deal done 2 points will definitely occur.
1- Collingwood won't want him to leave the club and won't want him to test the market so there offer will be very reasonable and represent a substantial increase on his current deal
2- Dayne knows the club want him to stay but he won't hold them to ransom. His history in contract negotiations prove he can get deals done without much fanfare.
Let's review history and look backwards for a second.
After his first season 2010 the club upgraded Dayne off a rookie deal and onto a better deal for 2yrs.
In 2012 Dayne had his management commence talks with the club (this was previous to him winning the Copeland and becoming an AA) during the course of those events his management attempted to quietly test the market (by not presenting an offer correctly to Dayne) and he sacked them.
He then came to terms for 3yrs (2013/14/15) for reported $1.1m
He now has 100 games a Copeland and been an AA so his position is stronger than his last.
His father clearly stated to me he doesn't want any of the circus that surrounded cloke's last contract.
He wants to stay at the club and is very happy where the club is at and respects Bucks and the other coaches.
To me it's a no brainer the club will be fair and so will Dayne so other than nutting out maybe the length or how much is paid each year (if the club has some cap issues in the coming years) the deal will get done I'm sure without any hassles. It mightn't be this week or even this month but I can't wait for the announcement to happen. |
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Bucks2014
Joined: 15 Feb 2014
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One of my favourites is Beamsy, I think this thread is right on the money and can't see him ever going anywhere. You can see the respect he has for the Coach in particular. I can't remember who it was we played, but in one of his interviews this year he said credit needs to go to Bucks, he doesn't yell and scream which I took as a swipe to the great MM.
Beamsy use to catch up for coffee regularly with Bucks prior to Bucks becoming an assistant coach.
Really enjoy listening to what he has to stay, seems to have a fantastic football brain and could be possible captain material IMO.
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"Still waiting for your call Caroline ... not a quote in sight. Don't ever presume to speak on Collingwood's behalf," |
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roar
Joined: 01 Sep 2004
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Doing the No.17 proud.
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kill for collingwood! |
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qldmagpie67
Joined: 18 Dec 2008
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| Bucks2014 wrote: | One of my favourites is Beamsy, I think this thread is right on the money and can't see him ever going anywhere. You can see the respect he has for the Coach in particular. I can't remember who it was we played, but in one of his interviews this year he said credit needs to go to Bucks, he doesn't yell and scream which I took as a swipe to the great MM.
Beamsy use to catch up for coffee regularly with Bucks prior to Bucks becoming an assistant coach.
Really enjoy listening to what he has to stay, seems to have a fantastic football brain and could be possible captain material IMO. |
Bucks your correct he has great respect for the coach. As I stated at the beginning of the post he said when he started his career at the club Bucks spent a lot of time talking and helping him on the little nuances of the game.
Let's not forget Dayne had the chance to join the reported "brat pack" but chose to follow Pendles instead. I think this speaks a lot about where he wants his career and football to go. |
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Bob Sugar
Joined: 11 Feb 2010
Location: Benalla
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| E wrote: | | 35forever wrote: | | MJ23 wrote: | ^ agree
Even though he wont ask for what he is deserving.
Im sure I read at the last contract neg he sacked his management company as they were not moving quick enough.
You put his development, attitude and club loyalty up against Dale's and you realise the supporters idolised the wrong bloke.
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Sorry, but I can't let this kind of hypocrisy pass, and yes, denigrating a great Collingwood player and criticising his loyalty in the same sentence is indeed hypocrisy! You do NOT know DT wanted to leave, I know he wanted to stay.
DT was in a very different position to Dayne. Collingwood is determined to keep Dayne and were determined to dump Dale. His popularity was a threat to Buckley & Buckley is known to have disliked the so-called "Brat Pack" since his playing days,. He has eliminated every member of it except for Swanny, (although Pendles was a member early and so was Dayne to an extent, but Pendles opted to be a team leader - and thank god he did - and Dayne followed suit - and thank god he did!) Another big difference is that DT & Bucks played together for a couple of seasons. Also while your talking about loyalty, DT was one of the first to accept less to stay at Collingwood. He definitely wanted to be a magpie for life, but his rift with Buckley put an end to that. To suggest that we are better without him is ridiculous. He was BOG in his last full game for us (StKilda last year), and we only have 5 guys with over 150 games in the side, three with over 200, and we'll likely lose two of those fairly soon, only Tooves is likely to join the 150 club in that time
I have no wish to turn this into another DT thread, but I WILL answer any question on the matter & respond to any weak attempt at abuse.
Back to Beamer, there is no doubt the kid is a gun, and we still haven't seen the best of him given that he's only 24. If Collingwood were silly enough to offer him unders simply because he wants to stay, it would be a monumental mistake. I have no doubt he could get 800's at any of half a dozen clubs, the guy is already in the top 5 players in Fantasy Football, and his form is getting better by the week. If we offer 200 and he knows he can get 800, he'd be foolish not to look at it. Loyalty, in the end, must have a price, especially when ones career is so brief & could end at any moment. And let's face it, there's no superannuation or pension plan. When Collingwood or any other team has finished with any player they may as well not exist, unless the player is one of the very few who achieve 'legend' status. |
I agree the pies didn't want him, but I disagree with your logic.
I think the simple reason we let daisy go is because of a simple risk reward analysis. He is not the player he was and was demanding to be paid (rightly so because Carlton offered it to him), Elite money. He was elite in 2010. Maybe our most valuable player. Not the same after the injury.
This fact pattern made it impossible for the pies to pay him and impossible for Daisy to stay. |
Bucks pretty much said he wasn't prepared to commit to that sort of coin on a player who had a massive injury cloud hanging over him, but I think he was being polite, Daisy is a fine player when fully fit but he isn't worth 700k.
considering he hardly got on the park for his last 2 years with us I think 350k would have been generous, and I'm sure we would have kept him if he agreed, obviously he didn't.
I know he always played well in big games, but I think he was a very overrated footballer with us, good player but not a star.
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Defender...........
On the day before the first, Daicos created God.
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Last edited by Bob Sugar on Fri Jun 06, 2014 9:16 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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AN_Inkling
Joined: 06 Oct 2007
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Just thought I'd offer some support for 35forever: my thoughts on the Daisy situation are closer to his than those on the "Dollar Daisy is a hack and a traitor" side of the fence.
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Well done boys! |
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