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Piesnchess
piesnchess
Joined: 09 Jun 2008
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| Wonka wrote: | | Cam wrote: | | If we are 4-2 and 8-4 next season and Treloar has what I forsee being a Travis Cloke season at the the Dogs, and Stephenson is getting mocked... I think only the stubborn will be looking backwards [and I could name a few lol] Money in the cap is numbers on the page. |
You can call people stubborn, but the point is that they care about honesty and integrity, about honouring signed contracts, and about treating players with dignity and respect. |
Dignity and respect yes, the issue was badly handled by the Club, was very messy, no argument there. But contracts ? Reminds me of that old movie, Willie Wonka, where the car salesman says to Wonka, "Dont talk to me about Contracts, i use em all the time, they are for suckers. " 
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Poverty exists not because we cannot feed the poor, but because we cannot satisfy the rich.
Chess and Vodka are born brothers. - Russian proverb. |
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David 
to wish impossible things
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: the edge of the deep green sea
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Feels a bit like a rebuild to be honest. And that's deflating if it means we're in for a few years of short-term pain, but at least our draft return seems to have somewhat vindicated the list-management decisions during trade period. I echo those who are still unhappy with how Treloar and Stephenson were treated, though.
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"Every time we witness an injustice and do not act, we train our character to be passive in its presence." – Julian Assange |
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Piesnchess
piesnchess
Joined: 09 Jun 2008
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| David wrote: | | Feels a bit like a rebuild to be honest. And that's deflating if it means we're in for a few years of short-term pain, but at least our draft return seems to have somewhat vindicated the list-management decisions during trade period. I echo those who are still unhappy with how Treloar and Stephenson were treated, though. |
The Saints turned it all around with kids, and bit of canny recruiting, footy can change quickly, next season could be a real learning curve, but its the years after that one, that will bear fruit. If we can make the Finals next season, thatd be a real bonus.
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Poverty exists not because we cannot feed the poor, but because we cannot satisfy the rich.
Chess and Vodka are born brothers. - Russian proverb. |
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BEAMER09
Joined: 10 Apr 2009
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| Piesnchess wrote: | | David wrote: | | Feels a bit like a rebuild to be honest. And that's deflating if it means we're in for a few years of short-term pain, but at least our draft return seems to have somewhat vindicated the list-management decisions during trade period. I echo those who are still unhappy with how Treloar and Stephenson were treated, though. |
The Saints turned it all around with kids, and bit of canny recruiting, footy can change quickly, next season could be a real learning curve, but its the years after that one, that will bear fruit. If we can make the Finals next season, thatd be a real bonus. |
Respect what you say about Finals and that's what we hear always from the Club because FINALS is a good marketing word to say and a reflection we do make and play Finals.
Well, for this Club - IT IS NOT GOOD ENOUGH.
We ALWAYS make finals.
We KNOW finals better than anyone else.
And it's not hard for this club to make GF's either compared to other teams.
Just WIN GF's would be nice and you don't have to win everyone either (would be nice) but let's not reflect the last 62 years either.
It's about time the Club set itself up to WIN GF's and not spin this rubbish that we have played Finals the last 3 years.
WE KNOW THAT!!! so ENOUGH!!! and SHOW ME THE GF WINS!!!...
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COLLINGW09D |
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MatthewBoydFanClub
Joined: 12 Feb 2007
Location: Elwood
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| At training this morning. This is the best batch of recruits I've seen since the Moore, DeGoey draft and maybe better when you look at the depth of players we recruited. As far as I'm concerned all is forgiven but would feel a lot better if we weren't paying so much of Treloar's back loaded contract. |
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orie 
A MADPIE FOR LIFE
Joined: 11 Apr 2000
Location: Heart and Soul.
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Missed the start.. Did they talk about the Stephenson situation??
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'MADE IT LEGENDARY' |
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Magpietothemax 
magpietothemax
Joined: 27 Apr 2013
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I am starting to comprehend more clearly, in the fullness of time, why we had to off load Adz. We came to the decision that the current configuration of our team was not going to win a flag, and the desperately tight salary cap meant that we could never recruit any significant players to change the situation. We had to bust the salary cap pressure. We then assessed Treloar's role and contribution in the the light of unremitting objectivity, and decided that he was the man we needed to offload in terms of overpayment for benefit gained. I guess we made a similar decision regarding Stephenson. This decision seems more dubious than the one for Treloar, given Stephenson's youth and his obvious electric talent.
However, as others have commented, the way we did it was appalling. Why did we not just say the truth from the beginning? I think that those responsible for our salary cap catastrophe wanted to conceal their incompetence by creating smokescreens, which created a noxious atmosphere. We should never have allowed the hurtful speculation which we allowed to descend on both Treloar and Stephenson. Both of these guys were 5 points away from being Collingwood Premiership legends.
Flip was discarded very flippantly as well, though he did not suffer from the same degree of innuendo and rumour mongering, and contrived excuses, as did Adz and, to a lesser degree, Stepho. I was not so opposed to losing Phillips, as I could see this year that the negatives were starting to outweigh the positives.
I still think we should have kept Stepho, at least for another year. Maybe he would have agreed to a reduction in his salary.
Overall now, I understand the motivations behind our actions. We had to address strategic errors with salary cap from the past. The manner in which we went about it was shameful. Unfortunately, I have noticed that under Bucks' regime there is a reluctance to accept responsibility that will hold us back while it continues.
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Free Julian Assange!!
Ice in the veins |
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think positive
Side By Side
Joined: 30 Jun 2005
Location: somewhere
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| MatthewBoydFanClub wrote: | | At training this morning. This is the best batch of recruits I've seen since the Moore, DeGoey draft and maybe better when you look at the depth of players we recruited. As far as I'm concerned all is forgiven but would feel a lot better if we weren't paying so much of Treloar's back loaded contract. |
hiya, do you know when and at what time the next training is please??
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You cant fix stupid, turns out you cant quarantine it either! |
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Cruisinwithdids
Joined: 20 Sep 2016
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| Piesnchess wrote: | | ^ How will he handle his family in Queensland tho, it would have distracted him with us, and it will distract him with the Dogs, lets not kid ourselves, it will definitely affect his over all performance, as it would with us too. |
Will the splitting of Nathan and Tania Buckley impact Buckley’s coaching next year? Seriously, what a load of shit. |
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Cruisinwithdids
Joined: 20 Sep 2016
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| Magpietothemax wrote: | I am starting to comprehend more clearly, in the fullness of time, why we had to off load Adz. We came to the decision that the current configuration of our team was not going to win a flag, and the desperately tight salary cap meant that we could never recruit any significant players to change the situation. We had to bust the salary cap pressure. We then assessed Treloar's role and contribution in the the light of unremitting objectivity, and decided that he was the man we needed to offload in terms of overpayment for benefit gained. I guess we made a similar decision regarding Stephenson. This decision seems more dubious than the one for Treloar, given Stephenson's youth and his obvious electric talent.
However, as others have commented, the way we did it was appalling. Why did we not just say the truth from the beginning? I think that those responsible for our salary cap catastrophe wanted to conceal their incompetence by creating smokescreens, which created a noxious atmosphere. We should never have allowed the hurtful speculation which we allowed to descend on both Treloar and Stephenson. Both of these guys were 5 points away from being Collingwood Premiership legends.
Flip was discarded very flippantly as well, though he did not suffer from the same degree of innuendo and rumour mongering, and contrived excuses, as did Adz and, to a lesser degree, Stepho. I was not so opposed to losing Phillips, as I could see this year that the negatives were starting to outweigh the positives.
I still think we should have kept Stepho, at least for another year. Maybe he would have agreed to a reduction in his salary.
Overall now, I understand the motivations behind our actions. We had to address strategic errors with salary cap from the past. The manner in which we went about it was shameful. Unfortunately, I have noticed that under Bucks' regime there is a reluctance to accept responsibility that will hold us back while it continues. |
if we were serious about trading players that would not win us a flag we would have traded Josh Thomas, the Brown brothers, Will Hoskin Elliott, Brayden Sier, Jamie Elliott and Magden - that argument doesn’t stack up - Treloar is better than all of them. |
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think positive
Side By Side
Joined: 30 Jun 2005
Location: somewhere
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| Cruisinwithdids wrote: | | Piesnchess wrote: | | ^ How will he handle his family in Queensland tho, it would have distracted him with us, and it will distract him with the Dogs, lets not kid ourselves, it will definitely affect his over all performance, as it would with us too. |
Will the splitting of Nathan and Tania Buckley impact Buckley’s coaching next year? Seriously, what a load of shit. |
its not a load of shit, i and others have said we get this, he has struggled with anxiety in the past, and he says his missus helped him through it, its not about that, its about transparency and rumours and the way it was handled.
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You cant fix stupid, turns out you cant quarantine it either! |
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Cam 
Nick's BB Member #166
Joined: 10 May 2002
Location: Springvale
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| Wonka wrote: | | Cam wrote: | | If we are 4-2 and 8-4 next season and Treloar has what I forsee being a Travis Cloke season at the the Dogs, and Stephenson is getting mocked... I think only the stubborn will be looking backwards [and I could name a few lol] Money in the cap is numbers on the page. |
You can call people stubborn, but the point is that they care about honesty and integrity, about honouring signed contracts, and about treating players with dignity and respect. |
You are assuming then that the players in question were full of honesty and integrity then, and deserved dignity and respect. Which is one point of view, there are other ones though.
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Get back on top. |
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Piesnchess
piesnchess
Joined: 09 Jun 2008
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| Cruisinwithdids wrote: | | Piesnchess wrote: | | ^ How will he handle his family in Queensland tho, it would have distracted him with us, and it will distract him with the Dogs, lets not kid ourselves, it will definitely affect his over all performance, as it would with us too. |
Will the splitting of Nathan and Tania Buckley impact Buckley’s coaching next year? Seriously, what a load of shit. |
Shit ? oh really, from what ive read Bucks split was near 12 months ago, its not recent like this is. Treloar has not even entered next season, and his family is in Queensland, not just in bloody Victoria. It could be a major distraction for him, who is too know, how come only the Dogs wanted him, nobody else, think bout that, this interstate family thing could affect him, lets see what happens.
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Poverty exists not because we cannot feed the poor, but because we cannot satisfy the rich.
Chess and Vodka are born brothers. - Russian proverb. |
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Gerry Cooper
Joined: 23 Feb 2012
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| Piesnchess wrote: | | Cruisinwithdids wrote: | | Piesnchess wrote: | | ^ How will he handle his family in Queensland tho, it would have distracted him with us, and it will distract him with the Dogs, lets not kid ourselves, it will definitely affect his over all performance, as it would with us too. |
Will the splitting of Nathan and Tania Buckley impact Buckley’s coaching next year? Seriously, what a load of shit. |
Shit ? oh really, from what ive read Bucks split was near 12 months ago, its not recent like this is. Treloar has not even entered next season, and his family is in Queensland, not just in bloody Victoria. It could be a major distraction for him, who is too know, how come only the Dogs wanted him, nobody else, think bout that, this interstate family thing could affect him, lets see what happens. |
I heard Treloar on ABC Grandstand just after the trade to Footscray happened, and his wife going to Queensland to play professional netball for a year sounded very well thought out. They had discussed it between themselves before the decision was made and she had made it clear that if he couldn't handle it it wouldn't have happened. Treloar said he had already informed the club of the arrangements they had made to make it workable and he was obviously a little irritated that Walsh and Co were trying to use their family decision as part of the justification for moving him on. To me Treloar's account sounded credible and authentic - Walsh's (as usual) not so much.
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We've all heard that a million monkeys banging on a million typewriters will eventually reproduce the entire works of Shakespeare. Now, thanks to the Internet, we know this is not true.� |
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Piesnchess
piesnchess
Joined: 09 Jun 2008
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^ The proof will be in the pudding regarding Adam at the Kennel. Goodluck to him, but i still say, why were the Dogs, the only club interested in him, one would think the Blues, Dons, Eagles, etc who love rubbing our noses in it, would have been lining up for his services, especially seeing we are paying him a fair bit to play at the Dogs too. ? Why no big clubs, why only the Dogs ?
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Poverty exists not because we cannot feed the poor, but because we cannot satisfy the rich.
Chess and Vodka are born brothers. - Russian proverb. |
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