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David 
to wish impossible things
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: the edge of the deep green sea
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think positive
Side By Side
Joined: 30 Jun 2005
Location: somewhere
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Gees thats annoying
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You cant fix stupid, turns out you cant quarantine it either! |
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regan is true fullback
Joined: 27 Dec 2002
Location: Granville. nsw
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HAL
Please don't shout at me - I can't help it.
Joined: 17 Mar 2003
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| What's your sign? |
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stui magpie 
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto
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I'm curious about how this will all unfold.
With all the objections against the postal vote, if the Yes side doesn't get up, what happens?
Do they accept the outcome? unlikely in my opinion.
If the yes vote doesn't get up, I can see an even bigger shit fight as they argue against the legitimacy of the result and the poll itself while having to stare at the elephant in the room which would be the No vote won.
best outcome is if the Yes vote wins (for multiple reasons) but that comes with it's own issues. Let's just say that Yes wins but there is a No vote of around 30%. (for the sake of argument, could be higher or lower)
Regardless of the actual number I expect there will be a significant proportion of the population who vote No. How they are treated by the Yes voters has the potential to decide how future social reforms will be managed. No voters aren't all necessarily homophobic, old, bigoted, irrelevant, far right dickheads. In fact only a very small percentage would fit those labels.
You can learn as much, if not more about how people behave when they win as opposed to when they lose.
I'm hoping for a gracious Yes win along with acceptance and tolerance of different opinions and resolve to educate and inform more change.
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Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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Mugwump
Joined: 28 Jul 2007
Location: Between London and Melbourne
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If yes wins, then the carnival will roll on until it descends on some other frontier. If no wins, there'll be an endless recycle via court challenges to the plebiscite process, and a demand for a parliamentary conscience vote, until it gets up. Let's hope it wins, so we can get on with politics that affect most people's lives.
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Two more flags before I die! |
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regan is true fullback
Joined: 27 Dec 2002
Location: Granville. nsw
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When the Gordon below Franklin dam was defeated in the high court the Hydro boys destroyed a Huon pine in protest and did as much vandalism to the forest as they could. When the Federal Government gained some powers over Aboriginal Affairs in 1967 the good burghers of Walgett and Moree ignored it and kept right on discriminating.
When the Bjelke Peterson government was finally thrown out in 1989 the local Nats blew up the Batcave. Queensland Nats have also poisoned the Tree of Knowledge in Barcaldine. It took 10 years of struggle to get rid of God save the Queen
So based on what happens next month I expect the Hansonites and their friends to do something equally spiteful.
if no gets up we wait until a change of government, usually when Labor gets in there is some human rights abuse to be changed, such as Conscription or Workchoices |
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HAL
Please don't shout at me - I can't help it.
Joined: 17 Mar 2003
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| I am surprised it took so long. |
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stui magpie
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto
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| regan is true fullback wrote: | When the Gordon below Franklin dam was defeated in the high court the Hydro boys destroyed a Huon pine in protest and did as much vandalism to the forest as they could. When the Federal Government gained some powers over Aboriginal Affairs in 1967 the good burghers of Walgett and Moree ignored it and kept right on discriminating.
When the Bjelke Peterson government was finally thrown out in 1989 the local Nats blew up the Batcave. Queensland Nats have also poisoned the Tree of Knowledge in Barcaldine. It took 10 years of struggle to get rid of God save the Queen
So based on what happens next month I expect the Hansonites and their friends to do something equally spiteful.
if no gets up we wait until a change of government, usually when Labor gets in there is some human rights abuse to be changed, such as Conscription or Workchoices |
If No gets up, even with a change of government it will be a while before the law changes. The merry go round will keep running.
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Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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regan is true fullback
Joined: 27 Dec 2002
Location: Granville. nsw
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If No gets up, even with a change of government it will be a while before the law changes. The merry go round will keep running. |
That's what the floog is hoping for, just like his finest hour the Republic.
Franklin Dam took 6 months. Conscription took two days. Admittedly God save Quoonie took 10 years, but I don't think the anti gay mob has the same grit and determination as the Land of Hope and Glory Brigade. |
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David
to wish impossible things
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: the edge of the deep green sea
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If no gets up (heaven forbid!), either the Liberal backbenchers will cross the floor or, more likely, the ALP will do it upon achieving government in 2019. Otherwise, the pressure will remain on Turnbull and I expect he will lose government in a landslide over it.
Don't fall for the inevitable revisionism if a no vote is successful. This voluntary plebiscite (or, as it's more accurately and officially known, a survey) is something that was, from the beginning, a highly politically and statistically questionable exercise. Any result it returns including a yes vote will be hopelessly unrepresentative and able to be dismissed by opponents in a heartbeat. At best, it's a means to an end for the right outcome to get up, which is marriage equality. Do you think civil rights activists in the US would have gone home if a voluntary postal survey in, say, Alabama had decided that 51% were in favour of anti-miscegenation laws and blacks sitting at the back of the bus? I would fully expect parliamentary and public supporters of same-sex marriage to not back down an inch regardless of what result this absurd exercise returns.
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"Every time we witness an injustice and do not act, we train our character to be passive in its presence." – Julian Assange |
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Culprit 
Joined: 06 Feb 2003
Location: Port Melbourne
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watt price tully 
Joined: 15 May 2007
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| stui magpie wrote: | I'm curious about how this will all unfold.
With all the objections against the postal vote, if the Yes side doesn't get up, what happens?
Do they accept the outcome? unlikely in my opinion.
If the yes vote doesn't get up, I can see an even bigger shit fight as they argue against the legitimacy of the result and the poll itself while having to stare at the elephant in the room which would be the No vote won.
best outcome is if the Yes vote wins (for multiple reasons) but that comes with it's own issues. Let's just say that Yes wins but there is a No vote of around 30%. (for the sake of argument, could be higher or lower)
Regardless of the actual number I expect there will be a significant proportion of the population who vote No. How they are treated by the Yes voters has the potential to decide how future social reforms will be managed. No voters aren't all necessarily homophobic, old, bigoted, irrelevant, far right dickheads. In fact only a very small percentage would fit those labels.
You can learn as much, if not more about how people behave when they win as opposed to when they lose.
I'm hoping for a gracious Yes win along with acceptance and tolerance of different opinions and resolve to educate and inform more change. |
If the Yes vote does get up then with all graciousness the Government can muster allow "No" vote people to opt out of same sex marriage if they so choose as soon as possible.
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“I even went as far as becoming a Southern Baptist until I realised they didn’t keep ‘em under long enough” Kinky Friedman |
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watt price tully
Joined: 15 May 2007
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| Culprit wrote: | https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=3&v=HjnTfoSEY38
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indeed.
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“I even went as far as becoming a Southern Baptist until I realised they didn’t keep ‘em under long enough” Kinky Friedman |
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stui magpie
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto
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^
Heard the audio of that on MMM this morning. The video skips a few bits, but nor bad.
For a pointless non binding postal survey, it's apparently had a higher return rate than the Irish referendum. seemingly less angst and nasty stuff, cheaper than a referendum and will get the desired result.
Overall, looks like a tick.
Be interesting to see if Shorten or the Greens try to block the Libs from legislating for same sex marriage out of some sort of protest.
_________________
Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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