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Jez07
Joined: 02 May 2016
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| Post subject: How do we trade our way back? |  |
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IMV this is the biggest issue facing our club in season 2016 and has even more relevant than Nathan Buckley.
We are looking at a bottom 4 finish and have no pick to show for that.
The 'rebuild' is delayed a further year.
Now some may say we are trading or looking at trading Cloke but when we do, we are virtually starting the rebuild again.
Of all the decisions Nathan and the club have made, this is the one that has the potential to set us back years. |
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Bob Sugar
Joined: 11 Feb 2010
Location: Benalla
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A rebuilds inevitable if we're serious about winning a flag, trade anyone who can't kick and get what ever we can for them, trade Cloke and our second rounder for a mid first rounder, that will at least get us a talented junior KPP in the draft.
Delist Toovey, actually sack him now, because he's shit.
Trade Witts, won't get a first rounder for him but should get an early second.
_________________
Defender...........
On the day before the first, Daicos created God.
You like this. |
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Mugwump
Joined: 28 Jul 2007
Location: Between London and Melbourne
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Actually after watching Grundy last Saturday, Witts ain't going anywhere, unless it is for a ready-made, proven 28 year old ruckman... I'd consider trading Grundy, who has trade value but looks increasingly unlikely to make it, to me.
Above all else, being monstered in the ruck cost us that game last weekend.
_________________
Two more flags before I die! |
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Bob Sugar
Joined: 11 Feb 2010
Location: Benalla
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| Mugwump wrote: | Actually after watching Grundy last Saturday, Witts ain't going anywhere, unless it is for a ready-made, proven 28 year old ruckman... I'd consider trading Grundy, who has trade value but looks increasingly unlikely to make it, to me.
Above all else, being monstered in the ruck cost us that game last weekend. |
Laugh if you like, but I'd consider playing Cloke as the no1 ruck, we currently sit 18th for hitouts and 15th for clearances so we can't get much worse in those areas, but Cloke will take contested marks around the ground (something our rucks don't do) and he's a much better contested player compared to our main rucks, doing this just might save his career, he has the tank to do it.
_________________
Defender...........
On the day before the first, Daicos created God.
You like this.
Last edited by Bob Sugar on Wed May 11, 2016 7:29 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Damien 
Me Noah & Flynn @ the G
Joined: 21 Jan 1999
Location: Croydon Vic
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What a load of crap. We don't need a rebuild. You two need to rebuild your routine. Get some new material.
_________________
'Collingwood are the Bradmans of Football'
The Herald - 1930 |
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Bob Sugar
Joined: 11 Feb 2010
Location: Benalla
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| Damien wrote: | | What a load of crap. We don't need a rebuild. You two need to rebuild your routine. Get some new material. |
If we want to win a flag we do need to rebuild, foot skills are vital now days and half of our team are considered ball butchers, sure our current group might make finals, might even win one, but we'll never win a flag.
_________________
Defender...........
On the day before the first, Daicos created God.
You like this. |
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Mugwump
Joined: 28 Jul 2007
Location: Between London and Melbourne
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| Bob Sugar wrote: | | Mugwump wrote: | Actually after watching Grundy last Saturday, Witts ain't going anywhere, unless it is for a ready-made, proven 28 year old ruckman... I'd consider trading Grundy, who has trade value but looks increasingly unlikely to make it, to me.
Above all else, being monstered in the ruck cost us that game last weekend. |
Laugh if you like, but I'd consider playing Cloke as the no1 ruck, we currently sit 18th for hitouts and 15th for clearances so we can't get much worse in those areas, but Cloke will take contested marks around the ground (something our rucks don't do) and he's a much better contested player compared to our main rucks, doing this just might save his career, he has the tank to do it. |
I'm not laughing at that. it's a constructive idea, and while it might not work, it certainly could, given a few weeks persistence. I don't think we're getting much value today. I'd also consider him at CHB. Having Cloke marking kick-ins would solve at least one of our many problems.
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Two more flags before I die! |
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Jez07
Joined: 02 May 2016
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| You will find that once and if a F/T ruck coach is employed, Grundy and Witt's output will spike. |
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themonk
Joined: 02 Mar 2004
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We currently have a decent list, pick up 1 or 2 free agents and move Cloke on, Travis will never regain his confidence again.
Oh, move on the coach if nothing improves in the 2nd half of the season. |
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qldmagpie67
Joined: 18 Dec 2008
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This is actually a very important topic.
For mine it needs to be a staged approach
Firstly we need to have review of everything football from coaching, development, recruiting, player welfare, fitness, medical
Once you have a clear and concise plan then you need to decide exactly where this lists sits in regards to what we want to achieve and in what time frame.
So as a hypothetical we will be getting s new coach
He needs to elvaute each player on the list and will they fit into his game plan/style.
For me then it's simple other than Pendles Moore Treloar Varcoe Reid Adams everyone else is available for trade depending on exactly what the new coach wants in his list.
We have built up a midfield of one paced players who aren't over skilled but then again a new coach may be happy to carry a few.
We have to many HBF for mine. So there would be a couple to trade there for sure.
I actually wouldn't trade Cloke as silly as that may sound. We need him forward line to take the big bodied defender away from Moore. Moore's body is getting to banged up and his 20. I see a Josh Fraser situation if we don't protect him.
If we are willing to be patient and wait for our time to come we keep 75% of the list and look at trading 6-10 players out and pick up some draft picks or some more experienced players to help teach the younger players as we go along.
If we think we are light years away and need a clean out then we go hard at the trade table and look at trading the likes of Crisp, Williams, Oxley, Elliott, Sidebottom etc whoever we can some value from.
I don't think we have anything to trade that will get us back into the top 10 in the draft but might be able to get low first rd early second rd picks if we parcel a couple players up
Maybe we can package a HBF type with like a Sidebottom and get somewhere near top 10 other than that we will have to rebuild slowly
Cloke's salary is going to give us cap room and if Swanny doesn't play again we will have decent room in the cap to chase a free agent maybe like a Hurley
Will be interesting times come the later rounds of the year. |
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thompsoc
Joined: 21 Sep 2009
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Question:
What would other clubs give us if we put Cloke on the trading table?
_________________
we don't eat our own at collingwood we just allow them to foul our nest. |
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Bob Sugar
Joined: 11 Feb 2010
Location: Benalla
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| Mugwump wrote: | | Bob Sugar wrote: | | Mugwump wrote: | Actually after watching Grundy last Saturday, Witts ain't going anywhere, unless it is for a ready-made, proven 28 year old ruckman... I'd consider trading Grundy, who has trade value but looks increasingly unlikely to make it, to me.
Above all else, being monstered in the ruck cost us that game last weekend. |
Laugh if you like, but I'd consider playing Cloke as the no1 ruck, we currently sit 18th for hitouts and 15th for clearances so we can't get much worse in those areas, but Cloke will take contested marks around the ground (something our rucks don't do) and he's a much better contested player compared to our main rucks, doing this just might save his career, he has the tank to do it. |
I'm not laughing at that. it's a constructive idea, and while it might not work, it certainly could, given a few weeks persistence. I don't think we're getting much value today. I'd also consider him at CHB. Having Cloke marking kick-ins would solve at least one of our many problems. |
I'd also play Degoey across HB, we desperately need some class down there and he isn't exactly setting the world on fire as a mid-fwd, he'll get his chance in the midfield eventually but for now he should be playing as a defender.
_________________
Defender...........
On the day before the first, Daicos created God.
You like this. |
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stui magpie 
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto
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| Mugwump wrote: | | Bob Sugar wrote: | | Mugwump wrote: | Actually after watching Grundy last Saturday, Witts ain't going anywhere, unless it is for a ready-made, proven 28 year old ruckman... I'd consider trading Grundy, who has trade value but looks increasingly unlikely to make it, to me.
Above all else, being monstered in the ruck cost us that game last weekend. |
Laugh if you like, but I'd consider playing Cloke as the no1 ruck, we currently sit 18th for hitouts and 15th for clearances so we can't get much worse in those areas, but Cloke will take contested marks around the ground (something our rucks don't do) and he's a much better contested player compared to our main rucks, doing this just might save his career, he has the tank to do it. |
I'm not laughing at that. it's a constructive idea, and while it might not work, it certainly could, given a few weeks persistence. I don't think we're getting much value today. I'd also consider him at CHB. Having Cloke marking kick-ins would solve at least one of our many problems. |
I watched a quarter from 2005 last night, Pies V North. We were up by 20+ points at 3/4 time, MM played Jason Cloke in the ruck and Fanning at FF in the last quarter.
We lost.
_________________
Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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September Zeros
Joined: 04 Oct 2012
Location: Behind you
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| qldmagpie67 wrote: | This is actually a very important topic.
For mine it needs to be a staged approach
Firstly we need to have review of everything football from coaching, development, recruiting, player welfare, fitness, medical
Once you have a clear and concise plan then you need to decide exactly where this lists sits in regards to what we want to achieve and in what time frame.
So as a hypothetical we will be getting s new coach
He needs to elvaute each player on the list and will they fit into his game plan/style.
For me then it's simple other than Pendles Moore Treloar Varcoe Reid Adams everyone else is available for trade depending on exactly what the new coach wants in his list.
We have built up a midfield of one paced players who aren't over skilled but then again a new coach may be happy to carry a few.
We have to many HBF for mine. So there would be a couple to trade there for sure.
I actually wouldn't trade Cloke as silly as that may sound. We need him forward line to take the big bodied defender away from Moore. Moore's body is getting to banged up and his 20. I see a Josh Fraser situation if we don't protect him.
If we are willing to be patient and wait for our time to come we keep 75% of the list and look at trading 6-10 players out and pick up some draft picks or some more experienced players to help teach the younger players as we go along.
If we think we are light years away and need a clean out then we go hard at the trade table and look at trading the likes of Crisp, Williams, Oxley, Elliott, Sidebottom etc whoever we can some value from.
I don't think we have anything to trade that will get us back into the top 10 in the draft but might be able to get low first rd early second rd picks if we parcel a couple players up
Maybe we can package a HBF type with like a Sidebottom and get somewhere near top 10 other than that we will have to rebuild slowly
Cloke's salary is going to give us cap room and if Swanny doesn't play again we will have decent room in the cap to chase a free agent maybe like a Hurley
Will be interesting times come the later rounds of the year. |
You would happily trade Sidebottom and Elliot??
I think we should keep them just quietly.
I also think if you were mad enough to package them up together you'd easily trade your way into the top 10 and them some.
Surely you wouldn't though?
_________________
No Pressure, No Diamonds
They used to be a happy team at hawthorn.
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Last edited by September Zeros on Wed May 11, 2016 8:19 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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piedys 
Heeeeeeere's Dyso!!!
Joined: 04 Sep 2003
Location: Resident Forum Psychopath since 2003
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| thompsoc wrote: | Question:
What would other clubs give us if we put Cloke on the trading table? |
Probably a good rogering...
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M I L L A N E 4 2 forever |
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